19:02:59 <marja> #startmeeting
19:02:59 <Inigo_Montoya`> Meeting started Tue Feb 21 19:02:59 2012 UTC.  The chair is marja. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
19:02:59 <Inigo_Montoya`> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
19:03:18 <marja> #topic The action list of last meeting
19:03:58 <marja> we had a lot of actions planned
19:04:02 <sebsebseb> yep
19:04:24 <sebsebseb> some
19:04:32 <marja> sebsebseb: do you want to start telling about how you're doing?
19:04:40 <sebsebseb> ok
19:04:49 <marja> thx, sebsebseb :)
19:05:18 <sebsebseb> Not done distro installs recently, but will be doing that, and so whilst at it doing the Grub stuff that was discussed last meeting.
19:05:22 <ajunior> I'm on! =)
19:05:28 <marja> ajunior: great
19:06:11 <sebsebseb> I have a Calenco account, soon after the last meeting, JohnR sorted that out :)
19:06:20 * Led43_mag2 would like to apologise for not helping out on install help txt, but will get on with it over the next few days, with an aim to finish first draft
19:06:27 <marja> sebsebseb: have you looked around?
19:06:30 <sebsebseb> yep :)
19:07:01 <marja> Led43_mag2: thx for being willing to still help :)
19:07:08 <marja> sebsebseb: good :)
19:07:32 <sebsebseb> seems Calenco isn't being used much at the moment though
19:07:46 <marja> sebsebseb: did edge226 and you get in touch about the grub page?
19:08:04 <sebsebseb> he'll help me with that if I need some help, I expect
19:08:11 <marja> OK
19:08:27 <Led43_mag2> marja: had some unexpected family things to deal with, but will be pulling finger out over next few evenings
19:09:22 <marja> #info sebsebseb got his calenco account and will sort the Grub stuff out when installing Mga again
19:09:44 <marja> Led43_mag2: that can happen, no problem, I hope everything is well with your family
19:10:10 <marja> OK, the help texts for the help buttons
19:10:26 <marja> Mrs B and grenoya have been working on them...
19:11:05 <marja> but both were needed harder to test things..
19:11:25 <marja> and I hardly found time to help
19:11:37 <marja> so still a lot needs to be done
19:12:10 <Led43_mag2> the page has been split into 2 pages at moment
19:12:20 <marja> #info texts for help buttons and screenshots: a lot was done, and still a lot needs to be done
19:12:38 <marja> Led43_mag2: that is correct, I was afraid the page would become too large
19:13:17 <marja> btw, it wasn't done yet, but the actual help text should go into a <pre></pre> block
19:13:35 <marja> because we add other information on those pages as well...
19:13:39 <ajunior> marja, I think that first important thing to do (to pt_BR language) is translate the install text
19:13:54 <marja> such a block should avoid confusion
19:14:04 <marja> ajunior: yes, you are right
19:14:15 <Led43_mag2> marja: i spent a few hours last night installing and doing my own screen shots to help me work from here so will be able to add a lot of txt soon
19:14:28 <marja> ajunior: only problem is, we are behind on what we should have done
19:14:48 <marja> ajunior: so there isn't much to translate yet, and the texts might still get adjusted
19:14:56 <marja> ajunior: sorry :[
19:15:04 <marja> Led43_mag2: great
19:15:07 <ajunior> I understand
19:15:54 <Led43_mag2> i think the boot loader auto installs unless it sees multiple disks or o/s during install, then it triggers the where do you want it window
19:15:54 <marja> #info the help texts on the wiki pages about the help buttons, should go into <pre></pre> blocks
19:16:12 <MrsBTest> hi all, be there in a few, just finishing dinner
19:16:22 <sebsebseb> MrsBTest: ok :)
19:16:26 <marja> Led43_mag2: no, it always chooses the MBR as default
19:16:31 <sebsebseb> MrsBTest: enjoy
19:16:51 <marja> Led43_mag2: so if you want something else, you need to adjust the bootloader while in the summary
19:16:59 <marja> MrsBTest: have a nice meal
19:16:59 <doktor5000> Led43_mag2: nope, location can always be set in the summary page, and mbr is default
19:17:08 <Led43_mag2> marja: oh i see
19:17:25 <marja> doktor5000: nice that you're here, too
19:18:03 * doktor5000 is hiding the whole time since we last spoke ~1 hour ago :)
19:18:30 <marja> well, doktor5000 already did his action during last meeting ;)
19:18:58 <doktor5000> marja: sadly nothing happened to the page in between :(
19:19:30 <marja> #info most needed wiki subjects was made, but doktor5000 is very sad because the list on it didn't shrink :(
19:19:38 <marja> #undo
19:19:38 <Inigo_Montoya`> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x85511ac>
19:20:17 <marja> #info page about most needed wiki subjects was made by doktor5000, but he is very sad because the list on it didn't shrink :(
19:20:56 <sebsebseb> marja: I don't think doktor5000 is very sad about that :D
19:21:22 <ajunior> marja, what can I help?
19:21:23 * doktor5000 is actually not very sad, because he knows it quite a LOT of work, but still ...
19:21:42 <marja> sebsebseb: doktor5000 OK, thx :)
19:21:45 <doktor5000> ajunior: take a look at https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Missing_documentation
19:22:10 <grenoya> hi, sorry i'm late
19:22:12 <marja> ajunior: if you have suggestions for the help texts, the faster those are ready, the better
19:22:21 <marja> grenoya: good to see you :)
19:22:58 <sebsebseb> marja: he meant sadly as in unfortunately I think, and so not very sad, and since English isn't your first language, I thought I would say this
19:23:02 <marja> #info tv couldn't tell what the limits are for the texts for the help buttons
19:23:12 <marja> sebsebseb: thx :)
19:24:07 <marja> #info camil is very helpful, but because marja's brain was being overloaded with information, she didn't manage to digest all he said
19:24:32 <sebsebseb> grenoya: ok no problem and welcome :)
19:24:48 <marja> #info lebarhon moved the wiki pages he made that are useful
19:24:58 <Led43_mag2> the smaller and more concise the better, it will leave more room on iso for drivers and such
19:25:44 <marja> #info marja didn't write a new proposal about the wiki's in other languages, because we haven't made good guidelines yet about what the wiki is for and what not
19:25:57 <MrsBTest> Yum! finished, sorry I'm late
19:26:04 <sebsebseb> MrsBTest: welcome
19:26:05 <marja> MrsBTest: good you're here
19:26:08 <sebsebseb> :)
19:26:13 <MrsBTest> hellooo :)
19:26:29 <marja> did everybody start watching their own pages in the wiki?
19:26:41 <sebsebseb> oh just thought of something
19:26:44 <sebsebseb> since you said about pages
19:26:54 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy was wondering where he could start pages about ARM
19:26:54 <MrsBTest> I did with the two drakx-installer ones
19:26:56 <Led43_mag2> marja: will do when i have some
19:27:05 <marja> Led43_mag2: good :)
19:27:26 <marja> MrsBTest: good :)
19:27:35 <sebsebseb> altough it seems looking back at that, that he figured it out for himself anyway
19:27:45 <Led43_mag2> can the wiki email people when there is changes to their pages?
19:27:54 <marja> everybody knows you can get mails when their
19:28:02 <marja> yes Led43_mag2, that is possible
19:28:10 <marja> I was just going to say that
19:28:22 <MrsBTest> i didnt know that
19:28:24 <marja> only if you don't check the page while being logged in
19:28:35 <MrsBTest> is that a setting somewhere?
19:28:36 <Led43_mag2> it would make things a lot easier to keep up to date
19:28:37 <marja> you won't get a new mail at next change
19:28:44 <sebsebseb> my user page, should I do something to that?
19:28:47 <marja> MrsBTest: yes, I'll try to find it
19:28:52 <sebsebseb> the profiel page or whatever it is?
19:28:59 <sebsebseb> Hi Umeaboy
19:29:04 <MrsBTest> thanks, maybe make an info for it so we can remember too :D
19:29:39 <Umeaboy> Hi!
19:29:43 * marja you should log in, choose preferences in the left bar and then the "watchlist" tab
19:30:00 <marja> hi Umeaboy
19:30:06 <Umeaboy> Hi marja!
19:30:09 <Umeaboy> How are you?
19:30:25 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy: it's the docs meeting, so any questions about the wiki for example, well this is a good time.
19:30:27 <marja> fine
19:30:42 <MrsBTest> there are some preferences to add pages automatically by the looks of it marja
19:31:00 <Umeaboy> OK.
19:31:12 <marja> you can choose which sort of pages you want to watch by ticking the correct boxes near the bottom of the page
19:31:22 <Umeaboy> Uuuuuhm. When are we going to get wiki.mageia.org/sv for example?
19:31:37 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy means a Swedish translation if that isn't clear enough
19:31:42 <Umeaboy> Yeah.
19:31:46 <Umeaboy> I'll update it.
19:31:47 <MrsBTest> I don't see anything about emails there though marja
19:31:56 <Umeaboy> Now that I've switched to the previous skin.
19:32:22 <MrsBTest> Oh its on the 'User Profile' tab
19:32:33 <Umeaboy> We have it in Mandriva already.
19:32:38 <marja> #action everybody log in, choose preferences in the left bar and then the "watchlist" tab and tick the box before pages you create
19:32:42 <Umeaboy> I've not updated it recently thou.
19:33:04 <Umeaboy> OK.
19:33:43 <marja> #action after that, go to the User Profile tab to set that you'll be mailed when something changes
19:33:43 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy: I think that's a question for the translations team as well
19:33:55 <MrsBTest> marja you have to tick the 'E-mail me when a page on my watchlist is changed' on the user profile page too
19:34:12 <Umeaboy> I think I've done that already.
19:34:17 <marja> #undo
19:34:17 <Inigo_Montoya`> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x86b73cc>
19:34:31 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy: ok
19:34:45 <Umeaboy> What marja was talking about.
19:35:01 <marja> #action after that, go to the user profile tab and tick the 'E-mail me when a page on my watchlist is changed'
19:35:02 <Umeaboy> That's what I meant.
19:35:24 <marja> I think Mrs B's words were more clear ;)
19:35:37 <marja> simonnzg: I need your help
19:35:48 <sebsebseb> marja: simonnzg seems to be away
19:35:59 <marja> sebsebseb: that's a pity
19:36:10 <Umeaboy> Leave him a memo perhaps? ;)
19:36:43 <marja> is there anyone around who has already changed things in Calenco or uploaded some new stuff?
19:36:51 <simonnzg> marja: Um?
19:36:59 <sebsebseb> hi simonnzg
19:37:11 <simonnzg> I'm here. A bit over-worked, but..
19:37:37 <simonnzg> Yes, I've changed things in Calenco. I was trying to do it just now uising various XML editors..#
19:37:41 <Umeaboy> I'm not sure what Calenco really is or what it does.
19:37:52 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy: Have you got an account?
19:37:59 <Umeaboy> Nope.
19:38:02 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy: yep didn't think you did
19:38:06 <Umeaboy> Since this is the first time I've heard of it.
19:38:09 <simonnzg> Umeaboy: It's a collaborative documentation server.
19:38:13 <Umeaboy> Uhu.
19:38:21 <simonnzg> http://freecode.com/projects/calenco
19:38:47 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy: if you come to the docs team meetings, and be on mailing list as well, and  take part properly in the docs team, then  JohnR will probably make you an account for it
19:38:52 <marja> simonnzg: could you upload the new helptexts and screenshots in such a way that they end up in the correct order
19:39:15 <sebsebseb> Umeaboy: some sort of XML editor or something, that Mageia is using for something
19:39:20 <marja> simonnzg: I think we have more texts than in 2005, btw
19:39:30 <simonnzg> marja: I *think* so. I'll have a go at it when I have a few moments of ME time.
19:39:43 <marja> simonnzg: great :)
19:40:02 <marja> simonnzg: it isn't ready yet, but knowing you could do it, helps :)
19:40:28 <simonnzg> marja: I'm assuming we've decided upon using the Master-DrakX-Guide as the basis for all of this?
19:40:44 * sebsebseb notices how Oliver isn't here this time, but marja is in charge now anyway, so that doesn't matter that much I guess really this time.
19:41:12 <lebarhon> Is Calenco working for everyone ?
19:41:19 <marja> simonnzg: when the texts are good, they can be used and maybe adjusted
19:41:29 <sebsebseb> lebarhon: yeah I got an account quite recnetly, not done anything proper with it yet though
19:41:48 <marja> simonnzg: but whoever works on them is free to make new texts
19:41:52 <Led43_mag2> lebarhon: i don't have an account yet
19:41:53 <MrsBTest> lebarhon: i don't think webdav works yet
19:41:53 <simonnzg> lebarhon: Yes, and no. Yes, it works, no it doesn't work as expected.. ;-)
19:42:03 <sebsebseb> Led43_mag2: oh you don't have an account, thought you did?
19:42:08 <lebarhon> I got also, but the directories are empty
19:42:27 <sebsebseb> Led43_mag2: JohnR will need to make you a Calenco account if you don't already have one.
19:43:00 <simonnzg> This documentation is in XML. Don't edit it except to modify text if you are not used to working with XML.
19:43:10 <sebsebseb> simonnzg: soundsl ike good advice to me
19:43:17 <marja> simonnzg: camil said the screenshots can be uploaded in near to any format
19:43:26 <simonnzg> sebsebseb: :-)
19:43:33 <marja> simonnzg: the format we use in the wiki is OK
19:43:42 <simonnzg> marja: Yes, screenshots can be in any format as they're not XML ;-)
19:43:43 * Led43_mag2 will read up on xml before opening an account
19:43:56 <sebsebseb> simonnzg: however certain XML stuff should be easy enough to learn, how to put a picture in for example, or whatever, I mean like HTML and CSS
19:43:56 <marja> simonnzg: but the help texts need to be converted to XML
19:44:39 <marja> simonnzg: I was afraid only one format was accepted ;)
19:45:12 <simonnzg> marja: Yes, they do. Not too difficult, but it's structuring them properly that is the pain without  proper XML editor. I've not found one that does the job for less than 100EUR
19:45:14 <sebsebseb> marja: just want to add to this, XML is only code,  then other files such as images are told to be used in the code
19:45:49 <marja> #info simonnzg will test uploading an adjusted Master-DrakX-Guide with texts and screenshots from the wikipages
19:46:10 <Led43_mag2> any recommendations on user friendly xml editors?
19:46:15 <marja> simonnzg: ouch, 100€ is  a lot
19:46:15 <doktor5000> marja: sebsebseb: Oliver is absent due to too long qa meeting/work, he needs some spare time, too ;)
19:46:19 <simonnzg> sebsebseb: XML is a bit like HTML, you can certainly write web pages in XML, but when you're talking structured documentation, it's not so straight-forward. Adding pictures is not too hard, though.
19:46:46 <sebsebseb> simonnzg: yep I know it's like HTML, plus I know about XHTML, converted HTML to XHTML before even :D
19:47:01 <simonnzg> marja: I'll download the DrakX Guide and play with it off-line, I think ;-)
19:47:03 <sebsebseb> and for webpages XHTML  or HTML or HTML5, would be used normally instead of XML
19:47:04 <marja> we already started talking about our 2nd topic :)
19:47:17 <marja> #topic Calenco
19:47:53 * sebsebseb notices how when marja does a new topic, it's not changing the topic of the channel, like is done with the packaging meetings in #mageia-dev
19:48:10 <sebsebseb> I guess that's just to do with the bot
19:48:12 <marja> Camil suggested I'd split the Master-DrakX-Guide and give everyone a part to update....
19:48:55 <MrsBTest> good idea, so long as they know what theyre writing about
19:49:03 <marja> but I think what we are doing now in the wiki, is for now the best
19:49:04 <sebsebseb> Led43_mag2: you can get a Calenco account sorted out by JohnR soon by hte way, even if like me you don't really know XML at this time.
19:49:29 <MrsBTest> we could always do our best and get grenoya to look at the rest ;)
19:49:33 <marja> the pictures and the texts from the wiki can be used for calenco later
19:49:42 <grenoya> MrsBTest: :)
19:49:42 <marja> MrsBTest: we agreed on that :)
19:50:13 <Led43_mag2> sebsebseb: i will concentrate on the wiki and iso testing until all calenco problems are sorted
19:50:15 <marja> MrsBTest: did you manage to download the Master-DrakX-Guide ?
19:50:16 <grenoya> MrsBTest: don't forget to correct my english after :)
19:50:23 <sebsebseb> Led43_mag2: oh ok I guess
19:50:30 <MrsBTest> no problem grenoya!
19:50:31 <simonnzg> marja: Maybe just keep updating the wiki and we'll try to keep the Guide following it until it's ready. As far as I can see, it's not that easy to convert the Guide into Mediawiki format. HTML, yes, but...
19:50:42 <MrsBTest> not yet marja, i'll have alook tomorrow
19:51:02 <MrsBTest> theres a few security updates to validate since we've been beta testing though
19:51:34 <marja> simonnzg: MrsBTest ok and ok
19:52:14 <marja> are there any questions?
19:52:38 <MrsBTest> yes
19:52:52 <MrsBTest> what is the Master-DrakX-Guide?
19:53:01 <tsiaro> Hi everybody!
19:53:08 <MrsBTest> hiya tsiaro
19:53:11 <simonnzg> http://vargas.calenco.com:8284/workspaces/Documentation/classifications/Manuals/en/Master-DrakX-Guide.xml
19:53:15 <marja> MrsBTest: the help button screens and help texts from 2005
19:53:21 <MrsBTest> ahh right thanks
19:53:36 <marja> tsiaro: hi :)
19:53:39 <simonnzg> From the Museum of Mandriva Past.
19:53:42 <sebsebseb> Hi tsiaro
19:54:21 <MrsBTest> i can't remember mypassword, hope its saved on the laptop
19:55:11 <sebsebseb> MrsBTest: can get JohnR to reset your Calenco password if you forgot
19:55:24 <marja> I understand to get it into installer properly, our help pages should be like those 2005 ones, but I don't yet understand how the texts are linked to the right place
19:55:24 <MrsBTest> i can't remember the login either :D
19:55:46 <Umeaboy> I've mentioned my wish for the wiki in #mageia-i18n.
19:56:04 <marja> Umeaboy: that is about translation?
19:56:10 <Umeaboy> Yes.
19:56:38 <marja> Umeaboy: we are not that far yet,
19:56:39 <simonnzg> marja: Aha the texts are linked to the right place by Magea! :-)
19:57:06 <Umeaboy> Alrighty then.
19:57:08 <simonnzg> marja: Actually, it's a magic perl script that does the work.
19:57:19 <marja> simonnzg: :)
19:57:25 <marja> sounds good
19:58:01 <marja> simonnzg: but when we have more help buttons now than in 2005 (I didn't count, I just have that impression)..
19:58:14 <marja> simonnzg: do you know what should be done, than?
19:58:20 <marja> s/than/then/
19:58:43 <simonnzg> marja: The whole DrakX Guide is about 900k when zipped. I just downloaded it. I can play with it away from Calenco and see what happens.
19:58:59 <marja> simonnzg: I put all my trust in you ;)
19:59:16 <simonnzg> If there are more or different buttons, then the script will need to be modified.
19:59:39 <simonnzg> marja: Never trust me to do anything. I'm too tired and too over-worked.
19:59:47 <marja> simonnzg: OK :)
20:00:12 <marja> simonnzg: np, the help text won't go into stable without being tested in beta 2
20:00:30 <simonnzg> Good!
20:01:08 <marja> #action Led43_mag2, MrsBTest and grenoya keep working on the help texts for installer in the wiki
20:01:34 <MrsBTest> not necessarily in that order ;)
20:01:41 * Led43_mag2 will do
20:02:36 <marja> #action simonnzg, only when he feel rested and bright, plays around with the Master-Drax-Guide and tries to figure out how to link extra help texts to the right place
20:03:11 <marja> I think we can go on with the last topic, do you all agree?
20:03:22 <MrsBTest> ok for me
20:03:28 <simonnzg> Yes.
20:03:33 <Led43_mag2> and me
20:03:38 <doktor5000> yep
20:03:48 <marja> #topic What the wiki is (not) for
20:04:09 <Umeaboy> Yes.
20:04:23 <marja> well, rda's mail helped me to understand what that second list (what the wiki is not for) was about
20:04:30 <Umeaboy> The wiki should only be changed if the information is totally relevant to Mageia.
20:04:42 <marja> did everybody read the mails about this issue?
20:05:01 <MrsBTest> skimmed them, can reread them tomorrow
20:05:11 <Umeaboy> Haven't subscribed to that mailinglist yet AFAIK.
20:05:28 <marja> Umeaboy: could you please subscribe to it, then?
20:05:53 <lebarhon> I did, I thing it's not free enough
20:05:54 <Led43_mag2> basically lets concentrate on mag stuff first add software stuff once wiki is up and running
20:06:17 <marja> lebarhon: yep
20:06:18 <Umeaboy> Yes.
20:06:32 <marja> lebarhon: can you say what you think isn't free enough?
20:07:12 <lebarhon> it's too directive, every one should be authirized to write what he like
20:07:31 <lebarhon> as long it is useful of course
20:08:03 <marja> lebarhon: you are talking about the last mails now, about "first things first"?
20:08:56 <lebarhon> ?? I do'nt knoow theses mails
20:09:20 <marja> lebarhon: [doc-discuss] First things first: What the wiki is (not) for
20:10:03 <marja> lebarhon: the mails I wrote before, were written with the (wrong) idea that a lot had already been decided by board and/or council
20:10:03 <lebarhon> Ok, these mails are very directive
20:10:34 <marja> but I was wrong to think that
20:11:03 <marja> and apart from that, seeing that people have started a Mageia wiki outside mageia.org
20:11:20 <marja> changes everything...
20:11:40 <lebarhon> You think to MLO ?
20:11:50 <marja> it becomes more clear that we can ruin things by being too directive
20:11:58 <MrsBTest> agreed
20:12:17 <marja> lebarhon: I was talking about the Brasilian Mageia wiki, which is very nice, btw
20:12:48 <lebarhon> You have already two other languages wikis
20:13:05 <marja> lebarhon: which ones?
20:13:26 <marja> french, too?
20:13:44 <lebarhon> Yes MLO has a French nice wiki
20:14:03 <marja> lebarhon: thx, I didn't know :)
20:14:16 <lebarhon> http://www.mageialinux-online.org/forum/index.php
20:14:47 <simonnzg> marja: Nice colourful logo. Can we nick it for the EN wiki??
20:14:57 <marja> lebarhon: thx, I've been to the forum, but I never saw the wiki link ;)
20:15:26 <marja> simonnzg: don't know... are there legal issues?
20:15:52 <lebarhon> Marja : Contribuer/au wiki http://www.mageialinux-online.org/wiki/contribuer-au-wiki-mlo
20:15:57 <simonnzg> Well, I suppose we could simply flood-fill our own logo's bubbles with colours as well... ;-)
20:16:21 <marja> lebarhon: very nice
20:17:50 <lebarhon> everyone is welcomed to write what he is eager to write
20:17:57 <marja> lebarhon: btw, you wrote on the ml that you thought a french wiki article couldn't be a lot better than an english one... but IIUC, that was obgr_seneca's pain, that in the Mandriva wiki the French had very good pages the English wiki missed
20:18:52 <lebarhon> Sorry IIUC ??
20:19:16 <marja> if i understood correctly
20:19:16 <MrsBTest> if i understand correctly
20:19:30 <lebarhon> Thanks
20:20:28 <MrsBTest> IMO if people are already writing elsewhere because they are not able to write on official wiki then we need to enable them to write on official wiki.
20:20:41 <marja> it is nice to see so many people around now, because I had a fear of people starting to write large pages about software that isn't developed by Mageia...
20:21:05 <marja> and that then after a year or two, nobody would be available to update those pages
20:21:16 <Led43_mag2> could the translation team keep the different language wiki's synchronised
20:22:16 <marja> Led43_mag2: from the discussion on the ML, I think we should only try to keep Mageia-own pages synchronised
20:22:29 <simonnzg> I need to leave. I am still in the office. If I do not leave soon I will be home just in time to go back to work!
20:22:37 <lebarhon> When a page is deprecated, we can delete it. It's better that have nothing from the start
20:22:50 <marja> simonnzg: nice evening :)
20:23:02 <MrsBTest> tararabit simonnzg
20:23:03 <Umeaboy> Or just place it in a temporary-list.
20:23:08 <marja> lebarhon: that is a good idea, too, i hadn't thought of that
20:23:13 <simonnzg> marja: Sometimes I don't like it that the UK opted out of the working time directive.. :-)
20:23:18 <Umeaboy> And send a reminder to the creator.
20:23:24 <marja> simonnzg: :)
20:23:31 <marja> Umeaboy: thanks
20:23:45 <Umeaboy> marja: For?
20:23:46 <Led43_mag2> simonnzg: have a safe journey
20:23:48 <marja> I'm not sure we can always mail the creator of a page
20:23:50 <MrsBTest> i agree with lebarhon :)
20:24:08 <marja> Umeaboy: your suggestion to send a reminder to the creator
20:24:22 <Umeaboy> OK.
20:25:40 <marja> #idea we don't need to be afraid to end up with unmaintained pages, because they  can be deleted when deprecated and before that, the creator can be asked to update the page
20:26:01 <Umeaboy> A message like this: You haven't updated "XXXXXXX" recently. If this page is relevant today please update it to keep it a while longer, if not, then just ignore this message.
20:26:15 <MrsBTest> nice Umeaboy
20:26:20 <marja> :)
20:26:41 <Umeaboy> Thanks.
20:26:45 <MrsBTest> do you think we should make a decision?
20:26:58 <Umeaboy> Flip a coin? ;)
20:27:07 <MrsBTest> or discuss further on ML with new ideas
20:27:21 <Umeaboy> I'd say more discussion in mailinglist.
20:27:22 <marja> MrsBTest: not yet, I'd like everybody to read the current rules first, and rda's reaction on the ml
20:27:28 <Umeaboy> To see how many that supports this idea.
20:28:11 <marja> #agreed we discuss further about what the wiki is (not) for on the ml
20:28:41 <MrsBTest> we should think about opening the language wikis too
20:28:41 <marja> #topic any thing that needs to be said
20:29:11 <marja> MrsBTest: so we should be fast to end this discussion
20:29:31 <Umeaboy> MrsBTest: Yes, I've already mentioned that here.
20:29:51 <MrsBTest> i was probably feeding my face then :)
20:30:21 <marja> Umeaboy: I agree, but not without a decision on what the wiki is (not) for
20:30:45 <Umeaboy> OK.
20:30:50 <marja> so if everyone can say his say in that "first things first" thread
20:30:56 <MrsBTest> was there any movement on simon's graphviz?
20:31:03 <marja> ouch
20:31:08 <Umeaboy> The wiki should NOT be for people with their own unofficial projects.
20:31:09 <MrsBTest> :\
20:31:12 <Umeaboy> Unless permitted.
20:31:29 <marja> Umeaboy: read rda's replies
20:31:51 <Umeaboy> marja: In the mailinglist?
20:31:53 <Umeaboy> OK.
20:31:59 <marja> MrsBTest: I think obgr_seneca assigned it to himself
20:32:04 <marja> Umeaboy: yes :)
20:33:35 <marja> sorry, thunderbird is behaving nasty, I can't check
20:34:16 <marja> it works now: obgr_seneca said:
20:34:24 <marja> Imported into Cauldron, please test, so we can backport it and install into our
20:34:26 <marja> wiki.
20:34:42 <MrsBTest> aah ok, yes i was going to do that wasn't i :\
20:35:00 <marja> MrsBTest: I suppose all of us forgot about it
20:35:22 <marja> #action everybody test graphiz in cauldron
20:35:30 <marja> #undo
20:35:30 <Inigo_Montoya`> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x8619b8c>
20:35:53 <marja> #action everybody test graphviz in cauldron
20:36:03 <marja> forgot the "v" ;)
20:36:11 <MrsBTest> oopsie
20:36:34 <marja> Is there anything else?
20:36:34 <MrsBTest> i think thats about all marja
20:36:47 <Led43_mag2> think so
20:36:57 <marja> I think even if it isn't, it was enough for today :)
20:37:06 <marja> #endmeeting