19:01:10 <DavidWHodgins> #startmeeting 19:01:10 <Inigo_Montoya> Meeting started Thu Jun 28 19:01:10 2018 UTC. The chair is DavidWHodgins. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:01:10 <Inigo_Montoya> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 19:01:14 <DavidWHodgins> #chair wilcal 19:01:14 <Inigo_Montoya> Current chairs: DavidWHodgins wilcal 19:01:21 <DavidWHodgins> #topic * Who's new? - If you are then come and say hello 19:01:35 <wilcal> Hi tj 19:01:41 <tjandrews> Hi. 19:01:43 <DavidWHodgins> Looks like a small turnout again this week, so is should be a short meeting again. 19:02:04 <rindolf> tjandrews: hey 19:02:27 <DavidWHodgins> #topic bug 23202 and upgrading using mgaapplet 19:02:29 <[mbot> Bug: ['during upgrade i586 Mga5 ( with kde4) to Mga6, task-obsoletes conflict occurs', 'NEW', 'Martin Whitaker'] https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23202 19:02:41 <tjandrews> We had a little over an inch of rain yesterday, so it's still to wet for outside work. 19:02:50 <wilcal> Is this holding up M6.1? 19:03:06 <DavidWHodgins> I haven't had time this week to test upgrades again, so I'm not sure if it's fixed or not. Has anyone? 19:03:19 <DavidWHodgins> wilcal: Yes 19:03:31 <wilcal> I've tinkered with a few. The kernel went through 19:03:33 <wilcal> rates 19:03:36 <wilcal> rats 19:04:36 <DavidWHodgins> #info Testing of upgrades from m5 to m6 using mgaapplet needs to resume. 19:05:01 <benmc> understand its waiting for the perl-URPM to be passsed, then the rmp changed from testing to updates 19:05:48 <tjandrews> My Internet service is too unreliable for that. It was out for two hours when I woke up this morning. 19:05:57 <benmc> so again a two step test 19:06:06 <DavidWHodgins> Ah. That's bug 23229 now 19:06:08 <[mbot> Bug: ['[candidate] perl-URPM & task-obsolete updates', 'NEW', 'QA Team'] https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23229 19:07:34 <DavidWHodgins> Comment added requesting a status update on that bug 19:08:13 <DavidWHodgins> #info mgapplet testing is still being held up by bug 23229 19:08:15 <[mbot> Bug: ['[candidate] perl-URPM & task-obsolete updates', 'NEW', 'QA Team'] https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23229 19:08:15 <benmc> sorrry, got 2 go - demands of a 2 year old. try to be back later 19:08:25 <DavidWHodgins> Ok benmc 19:09:32 <DavidWHodgins> #topic * Testing updates - Any questions or problems, long list 19:09:57 <wilcal> which ones in there can be simple install ok tested 19:10:03 <brian__> will try to get to openjdk this week. 19:10:47 <DavidWHodgins> With so few of us participating this week, not much point going through the full list here. I'll just remind everyone that we need to stay on top of the testing of updates. 19:10:54 <wilcal> I'll get to phpmyadmin today or tomorrow 19:11:02 <tjandrews> I can do a 32-bit check of Firefox this evening. 19:12:10 <DavidWHodgins> bug 23231 does concern me 19:12:12 <[mbot> Bug: ['nextcloud bugfix update', 'ASSIGNED', 'QA Team'] https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23231 19:13:21 <DavidWHodgins> I forget whether it was in a bug report or a mailing list, but the last update for nextcloud, the first we allowed as an update instead of a backport did break existing installs, with at least one complaint posted. 19:13:52 <wilcal> gracious 19:14:12 <tjandrews> Hello, Herman. 19:14:14 <DavidWHodgins> I think it was a mistake on my part to allow it through as an update. It violated the policy that updates shouldn't break existing running services 19:14:20 <hviaene> Hiall 19:14:30 <DavidWHodgins> Hi hviaene 19:14:39 <brian__> DavidWHodgins - whichever way you sish 19:14:43 <brian__> wish 19:14:53 <brian__> hi hviaene 19:15:23 <DavidWHodgins> Need to confirm if bug 23231 is just a bugfix, or if it will break existing installs. 19:15:25 <[mbot> Bug: ['nextcloud bugfix update', 'ASSIGNED', 'QA Team'] https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23231 19:15:41 <brian__> yeah - it says 12 to 13 upgrade 19:16:41 <brian__> I suspect a good number may still be on 11 19:17:16 <DavidWHodgins> I've added a comment to the bug report 19:17:18 <brian__> categorize it and then I'll test if you wish 19:18:05 <DavidWHodgins> Please go ahead and test it to see if it requires intervention other then just installing the update to continue working 19:18:32 <brian__> sure - big risk will be users of 11 which will be impacted 19:18:39 <brian__> as they were going to 12 19:18:54 <brian__> the same as going to 12 19:19:45 <DavidWHodgins> If users currently running 11 will end up with a broken install, then we will go back to requiring it to be submitted as a backport 19:19:54 <brian__> I'll test 12 to 13 and if gets moved to backport, I think we'll be along in testingt 19:20:07 <DavidWHodgins> Ok. Thanks 19:20:15 <brian__> I can promise they will be broken 19:22:03 <DavidWHodgins> The question then becomes how to handle it. If 11 to 13 will break, but 12 to 13 is ok, is there a way that we can have it as an update for 12 users, but not for 11 users? 19:22:40 <DavidWHodgins> I doubt it though, as I read what I just wrote. :-) 19:22:47 <brian__> I'll try it, sometime the developers build that into the install 19:24:12 <DavidWHodgins> I'll review the wiki for nextcloud. Ideally, it can be altered so that installing it as an update can be done safely 19:24:48 <brian__> thx David 19:24:52 <DavidWHodgins> Any questions or comments on the other updates? 19:25:06 <wilcal> not from me 19:25:17 <DavidWHodgins> #topic * Anything else? 19:25:25 <hviaene> Whenwill M5 stop?? 19:25:46 <hviaene> updates I mean 19:25:48 <DavidWHodgins> When the upgrading using mgaapplet is working smoothly 19:25:58 <hviaene> Grrrrr 19:26:02 <wilcal> We have to stop asap on that. Too painful 19:26:10 <DavidWHodgins> Agreed 19:26:14 <wilcal> Please say something about our Troll. I'm not sure who's who on the mailing lists anymore. 19:26:52 <DavidWHodgins> #topic The troll 19:27:30 <DavidWHodgins> The troll calling himself Andrew, who preiously went by John513 has been a major annoyance 19:28:10 <brian__> I appreciated the blog report. Good to publicize his/her behavior 19:28:32 <wilcal> i tend to be too trusting at times 19:28:32 <DavidWHodgins> All of the anonymizing servers we know of are banned from registering at identity.mageia.org, so he/she can not subscribe to our mailing lists 19:28:33 <hviaene> Oh, I was wondering if there was sometthing wrong with TJ????? 19:29:26 <DavidWHodgins> This doesn't stop the sending of msgs using the group aliases, or the sending via direct email to addresses harvested from our mailing lists 19:29:36 <wilcal> THERE IS NO MAGEIA MEETING HERE IN LAS VEGAS!!!!!! 19:29:49 <wilcal> I can't say that loud enough 19:29:50 <DavidWHodgins> :-) 19:29:55 <DavidWHodgins> I know 19:29:59 <brian__> oh bummer ;-) I planned to crash at your place 19:30:08 <tjandrews> Nothing wrong with me... 19:30:20 <wilcal> Everyone is always welcome here in my spare bedroom 19:30:23 <DavidWHodgins> Even responding to the troll in jest can easily be misconstrued 19:30:29 <wilcal> but calling a meeting here is nuts 19:30:30 <hviaene> Glad to her that 19:30:47 <hviaene> hear 19:30:49 <brian__> will note that 19:30:54 <brian__> troll 19:31:25 <wilcal> How can you identify if the message is coming from a troll? 19:31:53 <DavidWHodgins> As always, the way to deal with a troll like this is not to respond to him. Simply warn other cc recipients that it's a troll sending the message, unless you are sure the other recipients already know, in which case just ignore the troll 19:32:13 <DavidWHodgins> Look at the received headers in the msg 19:32:14 <tjandrews> For one thing, it'll be a private message, not from one of the mailing lists. 19:32:23 <wilcal> Ahhhh 19:32:44 <DavidWHodgins> It varies depending on what program you use to read messages. 19:33:15 <wilcal> Can I send him/her a private message from an anomious e-mail addy too? 19:33:31 <DavidWHodgins> With opera 12.16, the mailing list messages go into a seperate "folder", while the other messages go into my inbox. Makes it easy to tell, without even looking at the headers 19:33:49 <DavidWHodgins> wilcal: Yes 19:34:32 <brian__> wilcal: building a spam engine designated for him/her 19:34:35 <brian__> ;-) 19:34:36 <hviaene> wilcal: don(t bother, unless you want tosend your tie launching a counteroffendive 19:34:43 <DavidWHodgins> The anon servers he's been using require registration, and allow msgs in both directions 19:34:45 <hviaene> offensive 19:35:06 <hviaene> spend yor time 19:35:09 <DavidWHodgins> But as those servers are using tor for all messages, there is no way to trace him/her 19:35:15 <hviaene> fingers!!!!! 19:35:44 <DavidWHodgins> Do not respond to trolls in any way. It just encourages them to try to get a reaction 19:35:57 <brian__> if they get no where, they'll eventually go somewhere else 19:35:58 <DavidWHodgins> #info Do not respond to trolls in any way. It just encourages them to try to get a reaction 19:36:24 <tjandrews> When he offered me a position on his "committee," I essentially told him to go jump in a lake, and then created a killfile especially for him in Thunderbird. No more problems. 19:36:31 <DavidWHodgins> That's the hope. Some will continue for years, as it doesn't cost them anything 19:37:22 <DavidWHodgins> It can be tempting to "play games" with the trolls, but in the long run that just does more damage 19:37:45 <DavidWHodgins> So just killfile them, or at least do not respond to them. 19:37:56 <wilcal> In Google mail I just blocked him and reported him as spam 19:38:25 <wilcal> it's something 19:38:40 <DavidWHodgins> For myself, I just do not respond to him. I haven't killfiled him, so I can see who else he is sending to, to warn them if needed. 19:38:41 <hviaene> Like trying to onvert Win adepts to Linux 19:38:47 <hviaene> Convert 19:39:37 <tjandrews> If I'm going to engae in a battle of wits, I need an opponent with some amunition or I'm just wasting my time. 19:39:40 <DavidWHodgins> Good analogy 19:40:02 <tjandrews> engage 19:40:08 <wilcal> Anyway thanks for all the help on that one David 19:40:11 <DavidWHodgins> He's a waste of time to engage with, in any way 19:40:33 <DavidWHodgins> Glad to help. 19:40:51 <DavidWHodgins> Trolls have existed for as long as the internet has existed 19:40:58 <brian__> yup 19:41:02 <wilcal> back to anything else and the countdown 19:41:14 <brian__> nothing here. Limited bandwidth 19:41:14 <hviaene> There is one point now:: Some Win users have had it now with the lates Spring update 19:41:38 <wilcal> England's going to get beat 19:41:43 <brian__> Oh you mean wiping out the emachine (My wife's) 19:42:10 <hviaene> Nothing here now 19:42:17 <DavidWHodgins> While I agree m$'s continuous breaking of windows installs will encourage more people to look a linux, that's not really a topic for the qa meeting. :-) 19:42:28 <brian__> LOL 19:42:29 <brian__> true 19:42:37 <hviaene> wilcal: you ean football?? 19:42:37 <DavidWHodgins> Countdown time then 19:42:43 <DavidWHodgins> t - 5 19:42:48 <DavidWHodgins> 4 19:42:53 <DavidWHodgins> 3 19:42:55 <wilcal> bye all 19:42:56 <DavidWHodgins> 2 19:42:58 <DavidWHodgins> 1 19:43:04 <DavidWHodgins> Thanks for coming everyone 19:43:07 <hviaene> G' night all 19:43:11 <DavidWHodgins> #endmeeting