19:02:35 <lewyssmith> #startmeeting 19:02:35 <Inigo_Montoya`> Meeting started Thu Apr 12 19:02:35 2018 UTC. The chair is lewyssmith. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:02:35 <Inigo_Montoya`> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 19:02:54 <lewyssmith> #topic Anyone new here? If so, please say so. 19:03:16 <benmc> good morning. 19:03:26 <lewyssmith> Hello Ben. 19:03:57 <tjandrews> Hi, Ben. 19:04:15 <benmc> hi. looks like no new here 19:04:24 <lewyssmith> Few people her today, see no new names. 19:04:39 <lewyssmith> I shall make up topics! 19:04:50 <tjandrews> Uh-oh... 19:04:54 <lewyssmith> #topic The stack updates 19:05:42 <benmc> no news is good news? 19:05:44 <lewyssmith> It looks to methat QT(-KF5-Plasma-KDE all look good. What do you think? 19:05:53 <tjandrews> I'm perfectly willing to OK the "Big Four" and validate. 19:06:18 <tjandrews> iF IT WOULD HELP, i'D DO IT AFTER THE MEETING. 19:06:29 <lewyssmith> What do we do about LXQt though? 19:06:38 <tjandrews> Sorry. Didn't mean to shout that. 19:06:53 <benmc> lxqt update is problematic. i think nicholas was going to have another look 19:07:29 <benmc> i understand that that the other 3 do not depend on it 19:07:40 <tjandrews> The others can be validated. They wouldn't be pushed until LxQT is OKed. 19:07:49 <lewyssmith> Th emain problems with LXQt are: it needs LIGHTDM; it needs PCMANFMQT to work, or substitute PCManFM. 19:08:34 <benmc> tarazed. hi 19:09:07 <tarazed_> Hi Ben and TJ 19:09:16 <tarazed_> and Lewys 19:09:22 <tjandrews> After Len's test, I'd say that the appstream bug can be validated, too. 19:09:28 <lewyssmith> There is also the question of whether the developers have more KDE pkg updates in view. A couple were added recently. 19:10:19 <tjandrews> Aren't there ALWAYS kde updates in view? 19:10:39 <lewyssmith> It would be good to validate the groups mentioned; and lean on LXQt or ask for the update to go out without it. 19:11:29 <lewyssmith> tjandrews, Please do validate the updates you cited. I think we all agree. 19:11:43 <tjandrews> Sounds like a plan. 19:12:02 <tarazed_> Hi Brian 19:12:16 <bria_n> HI All 19:12:27 <lewyssmith> Is it worth feedbacking the LXQt bug to get some - feedback?! 19:13:57 <tjandrews> Dave has stated that the new lxqt, while far from perfect, is better than what we have now. I wouldn't know - never touch the stuff. 19:14:22 <lewyssmith> True *if* you run it from LightDM. 19:15:03 <benmc> sorry guys, got to go 19:15:26 <tjandrews> Thanks for coming, Ben. 19:15:29 <lewyssmith> Goodbye. 19:16:46 <lewyssmith> Decided: to validate everything eligible; to feedback LXQt. OK? 19:17:23 <lewyssmith> #Topic Other updates 19:18:16 <lewyssmith> I posted about a few sticky ones I cannot look at. A couple of backports are in hand. 19:18:52 <hviaene> Tomorrow I have time to dive in again 19:19:20 <tjandrews> tmb: I see another kernel in updates testing. Is it close to being ready for us? 19:19:31 <tarazed_> openconnect looks ready to go 19:20:05 <tjandrews> tarazed: OK, I'll validate that one, too. 19:20:49 <tmb> tjandrews, nope, but I'm respinning one based on 4.14.34 that will land for QA tests tonight/tomorrow 19:20:52 <lewyssmith> tarazed_, Len well done again. 19:21:16 <tjandrews> tmb: OK. I'll watch for it. 19:21:34 <lewyssmith> reminder: Python-paramiko (SSH2), libofx, samba are the main things left. 19:21:46 <tarazed_> wilcal will have something to look forward to 19:25:11 <lewyssmith> I am just validating openconnect. Fingers crossed. 19:25:28 <lewyssmith> Back! anything else to say here? 19:25:38 <tjandrews> I must say, once you install the Plasma etc. packages, the testing repos become MUCH more manageable. 19:25:59 <lewyssmith> So does the list of updates... 19:26:16 <hviaene> @ Lewys: got the message on openconnect. 19:27:06 <tarazed_> The remaining packages are a bit on the tough side 19:27:33 <lewyssmith> hviaene, What messgae? About the Plsam update? I answered that; thiunk it not applicable. 19:28:05 <hviaene> @ Lewys: |validated_update 19:28:36 <hviaene> System is quick!!! 19:28:37 <lewyssmith> Done. Is that OK with you? 19:29:41 <hviaene> Yes, quite OK 19:29:51 <lewyssmith> #Topic Mageia uncertainties 19:30:35 <lewyssmith> I raise this because of the recent waves about Mageia, talking of takeover, inaction etc. 19:31:17 <tarazed_> ?? Have you a link? 19:32:00 <lewyssmith> Let me explain. 19:32:05 <lewyssmith> I think & hope our Troll Andrew has gone elsewhere, for starters. 19:33:16 <lewyssmith> The main thing was a legitimate post on the French Mageia forum, which asked a lot of questions about what it is doing - or not. 19:34:03 <hviaene> Written by someone we know??? 19:34:36 <bria_n> oh sounds like a malicious takeover :-( 19:34:43 <lewyssmith> I think so; a valid and reasoned post. I will try & find the reference. 19:34:52 <lewyssmith> It was well referenced. Things like: the Council (or is there something higher) almost never meets. 19:35:23 <lewyssmith> Di you know that Anne is no longer president? I did not. 19:35:57 <tmb> yeah, she is stepping down for personal reasons... 19:36:08 <tmb> but she wont leave mageia 19:36:41 <lewyssmith> And can someone please tell me what was the state of the M4-M5 upgrade mgaapplet affair? Does it owrk - or not? I was oof-line at the time. 19:36:43 <tmb> she suggested to stay on as treasurer and maybe packaging stuff sometimes 19:36:44 <Luigi12_work> technically another group could "take over" if they came in and did good work and got elected to most of the leadership positions, but our processes don't allow for a hostile takeover, this isn't a corporation 19:37:16 <lewyssmith> I agree with all you say. 19:37:20 <Luigi12_work> as for the applet, Dave hodgins asked that we leave it disabled until we push the Plasma update and can test mga5->mga6 upgrades again 19:38:06 <lewyssmith> Thanks. But we *must* make it work. Carrying 2 versions is heavy. 19:38:08 <Luigi12_work> so based on what you said earlier in the meeting, it sounds like we're getting closer to being able to enable it, maybe by the end of the month? 19:38:15 <Luigi12_work> nah it's not heavy 19:38:26 <Luigi12_work> we're only supporting a small subset of packages for 5 anymore 19:38:27 <lewyssmith> ! 19:38:34 <Luigi12_work> and almost nobody is helping with security updates anyway 19:38:47 <Luigi12_work> even with only 6, things would be a lot heavier if people were actually fixing all of the issues 19:39:08 <lewyssmith> -2 That has always ben a problem for you. 19:39:14 <Luigi12_work> security bugs are being filed faster than they're being fixed, and they're piling up 19:39:38 <Luigi12_work> yeah but it's become more of a problem since I can't do packaging work from work anymore with this job, so I can't do most of the updates myself 19:39:53 <Luigi12_work> technically it was never my job to, but I did it anyway because someone had to 19:39:54 <lewyssmith> -2 We are forewarned. 19:40:19 <Luigi12_work> so it's yet another area that we're severely lacking in as of late 19:40:32 <Luigi12_work> the troll wasn't wrong about that unfortunately 19:41:14 <lewyssmith> Did 5->6 upgrade ever work reliably? 19:41:18 <Luigi12_work> I'm so behind on things, I'm not going to be able to come in and save the day like I did at the very end of 2017 and get us caught up 19:41:34 <Luigi12_work> lewyssmith: yes it worked pretty OK in my VM upgrade tests right before mga6 was released 19:41:44 <lewyssmith> We all appreciate & admire your effots, David. 19:42:03 <Luigi12_work> biggest problem was Plasma packages getting orphaned that shouldn't have been, so you'd lose some functionality when removing the orphans after the upgrade 19:42:13 <Luigi12_work> I haven't tested an upgrade since last summer though 19:42:35 <lewyssmith> Would it not be worse after the stack updates? 19:42:45 <lewyssmith> Welcome Shlomi. 19:42:47 <Luigi12_work> it should be better, since neoclust was going to work on fixing some of those issues 19:42:52 <Luigi12_work> but it just needs to be tested again 19:43:00 <rindolf> lewyssmith: hi 19:43:31 <Luigi12_work> I suppose if you have those qarepo.pl repositories, it might be possible to test mga5->mga6+qarepo upgrades to see how well it handles it now 19:43:46 <rindolf> lewyssmith: i forgot about the meeting today 19:43:53 <lewyssmith> Raise a new upgrade bug after releasing the stack updates? 19:44:45 <Luigi12_work> well it needs to be tested, I don't know if you need a bug report (unless something's found to be broken) 19:44:52 <Luigi12_work> tmb: we still need the memory limit on the BS increased for mga5/mga6 so we can build FF/TB updates 19:45:02 <Luigi12_work> it looks like pterjan only increased it for Cauldron 19:46:15 <lewyssmith> This upgrade is important for users a Mageia alike. We cannot advance without it. 19:46:33 <Luigi12_work> yeah 19:46:39 <tjandrews> Welcome back, Ben. 19:46:55 <Luigi12_work> the samba update can be OK'd for mga5, someone had asked on the bug 19:47:10 <Luigi12_work> for mga5, any basic testing is fine 19:47:23 <bria_n> yeah I was testing that earlier on 64bit mga5 19:47:29 <Benmc> hi 19:47:33 <bria_n> seems to be working, but just some painful config I have to do 19:47:36 <bria_n> ran out of time 19:47:40 <Luigi12_work> thanks for that 19:48:09 <bria_n> I'll try to finish tonight if possible 19:48:24 <bria_n> I guess tomorrow AM in EU 19:49:05 <lewyssmith> I will look in the morning. But what about those config fiddles? 19:49:20 <bria_n> that's normal 19:49:44 <lewyssmith> Good (not really, though). 19:50:51 <bria_n> gotta drop - I'll try to finish that tonight 19:50:56 <bria_n> bye all 19:51:07 <lewyssmith> The 3rd 'go' at Mageia was a private French Blog post, hostile; just opinion, though. 19:52:10 <lewyssmith> Mageia really needs to get its information out better, to inform & re-assure people. 19:52:30 <lewyssmith> The Blog is obvious; but forum posts as well? 19:52:45 <tjandrews> There are those who don't seem to realize we all do this in our spare time as volunteers. 19:53:03 <tarazed_> And we are thinly spread. 19:53:07 <lewyssmith> We need to say so; and solicit more, people harder. 19:54:04 <lewyssmith> That is not QA's job; but criticisms on this front are too valid. Do you remeber weekly or monthly Mandrake e-mails? 19:54:14 <tjandrews> It can be tough getting the non-technical to realize we have places for them, too. 19:55:21 <tmb> Luigi12_work, I'm not aware of any changes :/ 19:55:29 <lewyssmith> Could we have a users' mailing list? *That* (like for Mandrake) would help a lot. 19:56:17 <Luigi12_work> tmb: there was a brief discussion about it between pterjan and tv on the dev ml 19:57:06 <lewyssmith> Anyhow, I have said enough on this. Will try & find the lonks (e-mail deleted...). Move on. 19:57:20 <lewyssmith> #Topic Anything else? 19:57:49 <tarazed_> Evening Stig 19:57:56 <lewyssmith> Hello STig. You are doing a great job. 19:58:05 <Luigi12_work> seconded 19:58:19 <tjandrews> I think Nicolas deserves a hearty "Thank you" for all his work on the Plasam updates. 19:58:38 <tjandrews> Plasam=Plasma. 19:58:50 <lewyssmith> I agree heartily, & posted the same sentiment. And the other packagers. 20:00:03 <lewyssmith> So nothing else? 20:00:24 <hviaene> Not from me 20:01:17 <kekePower> evening all :-) 20:01:48 <lewyssmith> All right, thanks everyone for coming. Goodbye for this week. 20:01:53 <lewyssmith> -5 20:01:57 <lewyssmith> -4 20:02:00 <lewyssmith> -3 20:02:06 <tarazed_> goodbye everybody 20:02:06 <lewyssmith> -2 20:02:10 <lewyssmith> -1 20:02:25 <lewyssmith> #endmeeting