19:02:06 <wilcal> #startmeeting
19:02:06 <Inigo_Montoya> Meeting started Thu May 18 19:02:06 2017 UTC.  The chair is wilcal. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
19:02:06 <Inigo_Montoya> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
19:02:06 * krisNL the bot is fine
19:02:24 <wilcal> #topic Who's new?
19:02:32 <wilcal> so anyone new here today
19:03:08 <wilcal> #chair lewyssmith
19:03:08 <Inigo_Montoya> Current chairs: lewyssmith wilcal
19:03:19 <wilcal> does not look like it
19:03:32 <wilcal> #topic M6
19:04:11 <krisNL> very very ugly bug in xfce, bug #20888
19:04:12 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20888 major, release_blocker, kde, NEW , After a round of 28 updates on May 17, and rebooting, my Plasma Task Manager is broken
19:04:18 <wilcal> So the Council on Tues authorized me to annouce that RC2 will be put in the public repo. That to happen on Sat
19:04:29 <krisNL> oh sorry, wrong bug
19:04:39 <wilcal> Errata needs to be read by all
19:04:58 <krisNL> bug #20880
19:04:59 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20880 normal, Normal, bugsquad, NEW , Distribution Upgrade: Multi DE defaults to Plasma DE
19:05:18 <lewyssmith> That might be annoying, but is not a stopper.
19:05:20 <bria_n> oh yes - that happened to me and thought I'd done something stupid
19:05:27 <krisNL> again wrong bug, sorry
19:05:32 <lewyssmith> !
19:05:57 <wilcal> Well this is major issue for m6 that needs to be understood and discussed here
19:06:09 <lewyssmith> What is?
19:06:14 <wilcal> M5 -> M6 upgrades are problemistic
19:06:32 <krisNL> bug #20885
19:06:33 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20885 normal, Normal, jani.valimaa, NEW , xfce: .xsession-errors file is flooded with glib errors, Thunar
19:06:44 <wilcal> not all cases but for sure M5 KDE -> M6 Plasma
19:06:58 <lewyssmith> For me certainly, but it looks like a mirror issue on a vast upgrade.
19:07:09 <bria_n> interesting - I keep mine generic - it seemed to upgrade ok
19:07:47 <wilcal> M6 repo is still pretty dynamic
19:07:51 <lewyssmith> Have you seen my posts? Lots of replies.
19:08:01 <wilcal> Yes
19:08:19 <wilcal> Some platforms are more successful then others
19:08:26 <bria_n> KrisNL:  that is huge as systems will fill up over time
19:08:57 <wilcal> I think if you are using Xfce, and never installed Plasma, your probably doing ok.
19:09:10 <tarazed> Should one always check .xsession-errors - I hardly ever do
19:09:22 <krisNL> bria_n: yes, it will grow to gigabytes in home dir if user don't shutdown their systems
19:09:22 <bria_n> I wouldn't -- too lazy
19:11:10 <tarazed> 11 MB on my production machine
19:11:39 <wilcal> IMO the Council/Board may be faced with a decision to make a statement that an M5 -> M6 upgrade may not be recommended or problemistic at best
19:11:40 <bria_n> root cron job?  ;-)
19:11:52 <lewyssmith> bria_n: I have about 3700pkgs.
19:11:54 <bria_n> for plasma yeah
19:12:10 <wilcal> We have to make this decision in the next 6-weeks or sooner
19:12:30 <krisNL> bria_n: i have a script in autostart to nuke the file
19:12:58 <wilcal> I'm finding little things but nothing that prevents us from moving this thing public
19:13:08 <wilcal> that from a clean install
19:13:13 <lewyssmith> I am still awaiting replies to a few basic upgrade questions.
19:13:36 <wilcal> This will become an increasingly sore point as we move forward
19:13:46 <lewyssmith> Apart from that, M6 is fine for me. No problem hardware - video, wifi etc.
19:14:13 <wilcal> I also think we are losing Developer mindset because we're stuck on M6
19:14:15 <tarazed> All my tests have been positive but I don't push the envelope
19:14:18 <wilcal> they want to move on to M7
19:14:27 <bria_n> overall - M6 is working well.
19:14:33 <bria_n> wilcal:  ha - of course
19:14:35 <lewyssmith> Agree.
19:14:43 <tarazed> Agreed
19:14:59 <wilcal> So I will carry this message to the Council and/or the Board if it meets
19:15:02 <wilcal> time to move on
19:15:08 <bria_n> the office 100% cpu issue is a problem.  It will nail us on reviews
19:15:18 <wilcal> some OS's are just not 100% upgradeable
19:15:30 <krisNL> libreoffice bug is big
19:15:34 <bria_n> that to me should be a showstopper
19:15:35 <wilcal> I was tinkering with that today that is serious
19:15:47 <lewyssmith> Is it all LO applicatios?
19:15:49 <wilcal> Yes, that has to be fixed
19:15:55 <bria_n> otherwise we'll get "laptop battery life is terrible"
19:16:06 <krisNL> is the lo bug gtk3 only?
19:16:08 <wilcal> My i7 system don't care but others will find it awful
19:16:32 <bria_n> especially my single processor sempron int eh basement
19:16:43 <tarazed> Not seen that bug yet - always test LO
19:17:08 <wilcal> For the most part M6 in it's present state is very usable
19:17:21 <wilcal> And installable using one or more of the media
19:17:25 <bria_n> yes it is. I think the 100% is new.
19:18:23 <wilcal> https://forums.mageia.org/en/
19:18:28 <wilcal> is still broken
19:18:41 <wilcal> and that also is a showstopper for M6 release
19:18:59 <lewyssmith> Wiki images are broke, too.
19:19:07 <krisNL> is the 100% cpu LO bug DE independent?
19:19:14 <wilcal> That's why we are waiting till Sat to let RC2 into the wild
19:19:27 <wilcal> waiting an hoping that works
19:20:02 <wilcal> but we can't release M6 final until the Forums are back on line
19:20:08 <lewyssmith> krisNL: Chris, I will try that one.
19:20:25 <bria_n> krisNL:  no, I've seen it on multiple DE's
19:20:32 <krisNL> bug #20881
19:20:33 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20881 normal, Normal, thierry.vignaud, NEW , Libreoffice uses 1 full CPU when launched, libreoffice
19:20:33 <wilcal> some discussion on launching the forums without the historical data. Start from scratch
19:20:36 <bria_n> in latest releaes
19:21:14 <lewyssmith> As per the ISO, or updated since?
19:21:41 <bria_n> latest ISO's, both live and classic that I tested
19:22:02 <bria_n> live xfce, classic plasma and cinnamon
19:22:08 <lewyssmith> Thanks; global.
19:22:16 <bria_n> i586 and x86-64
19:22:36 <wilcal> All my Vbox testing looks good
19:22:57 <wilcal> I've moved all my Vbox testing over to my i7 M6 platform
19:23:49 <wilcal> Anything else on M6. Most of this we can't control
19:24:01 <bria_n> none
19:24:23 <wilcal> so then on to
19:24:25 <wilcal> #topic Testing Updates & Backports
19:24:36 <wilcal> list has gotten long due to work on M6
19:24:52 <wilcal> This weekend I'll get through the kernel stuff
19:25:05 <lewyssmith> Much of it is obscure, as well.
19:25:06 <tarazed> Yes the kernels are languishing
19:25:15 <lewyssmith> Am running the linus kernel now.
19:25:25 <wilcal> Kernels should be fine
19:25:38 <wilcal> just need to do the sweat work
19:25:49 <tarazed> Looking at libnl3 - has a tools package
19:26:08 <wilcal> takes me the better part of the day testing the hw kernel test because I make sure Vbox works in all cases
19:26:29 <wilcal> most of that just wait'n around for OS's to load and boot
19:26:33 <lewyssmith> http://madb.mageia.org/tools/updates
19:26:35 <[mbot> [ Mageia App Db - Current Update candidates ]
19:26:58 <wilcal> another Flash update. The weekly Flash dump
19:27:04 <lewyssmith> 20168 looks wrongly labelled as 'bugfix' when it has CVEs => security.
19:28:26 <lewyssmith> Does anyone 32-bit have local MH mailbox? mhonarc needs that, & is easy to test.
19:29:00 <wilcal> So I see a half dozen or so in there I've done before so I'll work on those along with the kernels thingy
19:29:16 <tarazed> VLC can probably be pushed along
19:29:48 <lewyssmith> I was able to test mhonarc with Opera mail & claws-mail. Perhaps Thunderbird?
19:30:04 <wilcal> Maybe I'll look at that one after this meeting
19:30:33 <wilcal> so we wait on M6 and lets put some cycles into the updates list
19:30:55 <lewyssmith> 19168 got the better of me tonight.
19:31:26 <wilcal> Think of these things as potential career builders
19:31:42 <Akien> mhonarc works well for sympa on our infra, so IMO you could validate it as is
19:32:06 <lewyssmith> Would you like to? Seriously.
19:33:02 <lewyssmith> If not, I will do it on your word (which is in the bug).
19:33:25 <wilcal> Something ok'd as 64-bit can probably be moved along
19:33:41 <Akien> I can do it yes.
19:33:44 <lewyssmith> I did; good test of functionality at least.
19:34:11 <lewyssmith> Akien: TIA
19:35:43 <lewyssmith> I have been validating impossible things just on clean updates.
19:35:56 <wilcal> ok lets move on
19:35:58 <wilcal> #topic Anything Else?
19:36:04 <krisNL> how can we ever get a stabilized M6 version if the packagers keep submitting new packages, introducing new bugs?
19:36:35 <wilcal> time for a hard freeze but IMO developers love the new stuff
19:36:39 <bria_n> good question.  how does that freeze get initiated experienced folks?
19:36:51 <wilcal> we need to move on to M7 to get them excited again
19:36:54 <lewyssmith> How many 'new' bugs are introduced, or were always there but not noticed?
19:37:08 <bria_n> libreoffice is an example
19:37:11 <bria_n> it wasn't doing that
19:37:13 <wilcal> The big chunks are behind us
19:37:23 <krisNL> at leat 2 critical, most likely by gtk3 and gnome stuff
19:37:32 <wilcal> i don't remember seeing the LO thing
19:37:40 <lewyssmith> Yet...
19:38:05 <lewyssmith> Benmc: Welcome, Ben.
19:38:29 <Benmc> Lewis, QA, good morning
19:38:48 <lewyssmith> Good morrow to you!
19:38:52 <wilcal> We're in the Anything else part of the meeting. Anything you want to add
19:39:14 <wilcal> m6 is kinda in wait due to some big bugs
19:39:38 <wilcal> discussion forum is down and that will ultimately hold up of M6 final release
19:39:52 <tarazed> Generally in good shape though
19:40:04 <wilcal> m6 is kinda in wait due to some big bugs
19:40:18 <wilcal> Yes, M6 is very usable for most of us
19:40:34 <wilcal> this laptop I am using now is an example
19:40:40 <Benmc> pretty good shape. just finishing option 3 of an upgrade types. see how it goes
19:41:11 <wilcal> Upgrading from M5 -> M6 is very problemistic
19:41:20 <lewyssmith> Not always, Bill.
19:41:21 <wilcal> may in some cases not be overcomable
19:41:38 <wilcal> correct some folks may never see a problem
19:41:43 <Benmc> using on-line cauldron media and upgrading a running system
19:41:58 <wilcal> KDE -> Plasma is kinda like walking the plank
19:42:20 <lewyssmith> Benmc: How many pkgs?
19:42:20 <Benmc> not if it is part af a multi DE install
19:42:32 <Benmc> 2800 something
19:42:40 <wilcal> Some folks have reported as many as 4000 rpms in the upgrade
19:42:47 <wilcal> I'm seeing over 3000
19:43:02 <lewyssmith> Benmc: A lot.  Tell me how you get on.
19:43:22 <Benmc> ok
19:43:43 <wilcal> Consider it an adventure
19:43:58 <lewyssmith> To drive you spare if it fails.
19:44:11 <Benmc> hasnt yet
19:44:31 <lewyssmith> Does this mean a stable mirror?
19:44:40 <Benmc> you bet
19:44:54 <wilcal> I should do an M5 Xfce to M6 Xfce upgrade and see how well that does
19:45:04 <lewyssmith> Benmc: Maybe I should try it.
19:45:30 <Benmc> i will send you a tip or two
19:45:39 <tarazed> I did a couple - no problems - no extra media
19:45:55 <wilcal> Note I rsync to mirrors.kernel.org ( in that process twice ) every morning at 4AM and don't make any changes to my local repo unless it really needs it
19:46:13 <wilcal> so I rsync and 5-min later rsync again
19:46:31 <lewyssmith> tarazed: So you will reply to my latest post about this?
19:46:48 <bria_n> mine have been lucky with those upgrades, from classic dvd
19:46:49 <wilcal> that's mid morning in Europe and the repo tends to be pretty quite then
19:46:56 <tarazed> Sure.  Have not seen it yet.
19:47:05 <lewyssmith> bria_n: With addeed media?
19:48:07 <bria_n> nothing exotic, except owncloud and ftp services
19:48:16 <wilcal> Anything else folks
19:48:29 <lewyssmith> Benmc: -n You have already primed me with info, which I appreciate.
19:48:43 <lewyssmith> No more here.
19:48:51 <krisNL> no
19:48:53 <tarazed> Nowt
19:48:55 <wilcal> nor from me
19:49:11 <wilcal> T-5
19:49:15 <lewyssmith> Thanks to those who came, to Bill for chairing. goodbye all.
19:49:19 <wilcal> T-4
19:49:24 <wilcal> T-3
19:49:25 <wilcal> bye all
19:49:26 <tarazed> So long
19:49:30 <wilcal> t_2
19:49:34 <wilcal> T-1
19:49:39 <wilcal> #endmeeting