19:02:06 <wilcal> #startmeeting 19:02:06 <Inigo_Montoya> Meeting started Thu May 18 19:02:06 2017 UTC. The chair is wilcal. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:02:06 <Inigo_Montoya> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 19:02:06 * krisNL the bot is fine 19:02:24 <wilcal> #topic Who's new? 19:02:32 <wilcal> so anyone new here today 19:03:08 <wilcal> #chair lewyssmith 19:03:08 <Inigo_Montoya> Current chairs: lewyssmith wilcal 19:03:19 <wilcal> does not look like it 19:03:32 <wilcal> #topic M6 19:04:11 <krisNL> very very ugly bug in xfce, bug #20888 19:04:12 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20888 major, release_blocker, kde, NEW , After a round of 28 updates on May 17, and rebooting, my Plasma Task Manager is broken 19:04:18 <wilcal> So the Council on Tues authorized me to annouce that RC2 will be put in the public repo. That to happen on Sat 19:04:29 <krisNL> oh sorry, wrong bug 19:04:39 <wilcal> Errata needs to be read by all 19:04:58 <krisNL> bug #20880 19:04:59 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20880 normal, Normal, bugsquad, NEW , Distribution Upgrade: Multi DE defaults to Plasma DE 19:05:18 <lewyssmith> That might be annoying, but is not a stopper. 19:05:20 <bria_n> oh yes - that happened to me and thought I'd done something stupid 19:05:27 <krisNL> again wrong bug, sorry 19:05:32 <lewyssmith> ! 19:05:57 <wilcal> Well this is major issue for m6 that needs to be understood and discussed here 19:06:09 <lewyssmith> What is? 19:06:14 <wilcal> M5 -> M6 upgrades are problemistic 19:06:32 <krisNL> bug #20885 19:06:33 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20885 normal, Normal, jani.valimaa, NEW , xfce: .xsession-errors file is flooded with glib errors, Thunar 19:06:44 <wilcal> not all cases but for sure M5 KDE -> M6 Plasma 19:06:58 <lewyssmith> For me certainly, but it looks like a mirror issue on a vast upgrade. 19:07:09 <bria_n> interesting - I keep mine generic - it seemed to upgrade ok 19:07:47 <wilcal> M6 repo is still pretty dynamic 19:07:51 <lewyssmith> Have you seen my posts? Lots of replies. 19:08:01 <wilcal> Yes 19:08:19 <wilcal> Some platforms are more successful then others 19:08:26 <bria_n> KrisNL: that is huge as systems will fill up over time 19:08:57 <wilcal> I think if you are using Xfce, and never installed Plasma, your probably doing ok. 19:09:10 <tarazed> Should one always check .xsession-errors - I hardly ever do 19:09:22 <krisNL> bria_n: yes, it will grow to gigabytes in home dir if user don't shutdown their systems 19:09:22 <bria_n> I wouldn't -- too lazy 19:11:10 <tarazed> 11 MB on my production machine 19:11:39 <wilcal> IMO the Council/Board may be faced with a decision to make a statement that an M5 -> M6 upgrade may not be recommended or problemistic at best 19:11:40 <bria_n> root cron job? ;-) 19:11:52 <lewyssmith> bria_n: I have about 3700pkgs. 19:11:54 <bria_n> for plasma yeah 19:12:10 <wilcal> We have to make this decision in the next 6-weeks or sooner 19:12:30 <krisNL> bria_n: i have a script in autostart to nuke the file 19:12:58 <wilcal> I'm finding little things but nothing that prevents us from moving this thing public 19:13:08 <wilcal> that from a clean install 19:13:13 <lewyssmith> I am still awaiting replies to a few basic upgrade questions. 19:13:36 <wilcal> This will become an increasingly sore point as we move forward 19:13:46 <lewyssmith> Apart from that, M6 is fine for me. No problem hardware - video, wifi etc. 19:14:13 <wilcal> I also think we are losing Developer mindset because we're stuck on M6 19:14:15 <tarazed> All my tests have been positive but I don't push the envelope 19:14:18 <wilcal> they want to move on to M7 19:14:27 <bria_n> overall - M6 is working well. 19:14:33 <bria_n> wilcal: ha - of course 19:14:35 <lewyssmith> Agree. 19:14:43 <tarazed> Agreed 19:14:59 <wilcal> So I will carry this message to the Council and/or the Board if it meets 19:15:02 <wilcal> time to move on 19:15:08 <bria_n> the office 100% cpu issue is a problem. It will nail us on reviews 19:15:18 <wilcal> some OS's are just not 100% upgradeable 19:15:30 <krisNL> libreoffice bug is big 19:15:34 <bria_n> that to me should be a showstopper 19:15:35 <wilcal> I was tinkering with that today that is serious 19:15:47 <lewyssmith> Is it all LO applicatios? 19:15:49 <wilcal> Yes, that has to be fixed 19:15:55 <bria_n> otherwise we'll get "laptop battery life is terrible" 19:16:06 <krisNL> is the lo bug gtk3 only? 19:16:08 <wilcal> My i7 system don't care but others will find it awful 19:16:32 <bria_n> especially my single processor sempron int eh basement 19:16:43 <tarazed> Not seen that bug yet - always test LO 19:17:08 <wilcal> For the most part M6 in it's present state is very usable 19:17:21 <wilcal> And installable using one or more of the media 19:17:25 <bria_n> yes it is. I think the 100% is new. 19:18:23 <wilcal> https://forums.mageia.org/en/ 19:18:28 <wilcal> is still broken 19:18:41 <wilcal> and that also is a showstopper for M6 release 19:18:59 <lewyssmith> Wiki images are broke, too. 19:19:07 <krisNL> is the 100% cpu LO bug DE independent? 19:19:14 <wilcal> That's why we are waiting till Sat to let RC2 into the wild 19:19:27 <wilcal> waiting an hoping that works 19:20:02 <wilcal> but we can't release M6 final until the Forums are back on line 19:20:08 <lewyssmith> krisNL: Chris, I will try that one. 19:20:25 <bria_n> krisNL: no, I've seen it on multiple DE's 19:20:32 <krisNL> bug #20881 19:20:33 <[mbot> Bug https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20881 normal, Normal, thierry.vignaud, NEW , Libreoffice uses 1 full CPU when launched, libreoffice 19:20:33 <wilcal> some discussion on launching the forums without the historical data. Start from scratch 19:20:36 <bria_n> in latest releaes 19:21:14 <lewyssmith> As per the ISO, or updated since? 19:21:41 <bria_n> latest ISO's, both live and classic that I tested 19:22:02 <bria_n> live xfce, classic plasma and cinnamon 19:22:08 <lewyssmith> Thanks; global. 19:22:16 <bria_n> i586 and x86-64 19:22:36 <wilcal> All my Vbox testing looks good 19:22:57 <wilcal> I've moved all my Vbox testing over to my i7 M6 platform 19:23:49 <wilcal> Anything else on M6. Most of this we can't control 19:24:01 <bria_n> none 19:24:23 <wilcal> so then on to 19:24:25 <wilcal> #topic Testing Updates & Backports 19:24:36 <wilcal> list has gotten long due to work on M6 19:24:52 <wilcal> This weekend I'll get through the kernel stuff 19:25:05 <lewyssmith> Much of it is obscure, as well. 19:25:06 <tarazed> Yes the kernels are languishing 19:25:15 <lewyssmith> Am running the linus kernel now. 19:25:25 <wilcal> Kernels should be fine 19:25:38 <wilcal> just need to do the sweat work 19:25:49 <tarazed> Looking at libnl3 - has a tools package 19:26:08 <wilcal> takes me the better part of the day testing the hw kernel test because I make sure Vbox works in all cases 19:26:29 <wilcal> most of that just wait'n around for OS's to load and boot 19:26:33 <lewyssmith> http://madb.mageia.org/tools/updates 19:26:35 <[mbot> [ Mageia App Db - Current Update candidates ] 19:26:58 <wilcal> another Flash update. The weekly Flash dump 19:27:04 <lewyssmith> 20168 looks wrongly labelled as 'bugfix' when it has CVEs => security. 19:28:26 <lewyssmith> Does anyone 32-bit have local MH mailbox? mhonarc needs that, & is easy to test. 19:29:00 <wilcal> So I see a half dozen or so in there I've done before so I'll work on those along with the kernels thingy 19:29:16 <tarazed> VLC can probably be pushed along 19:29:48 <lewyssmith> I was able to test mhonarc with Opera mail & claws-mail. Perhaps Thunderbird? 19:30:04 <wilcal> Maybe I'll look at that one after this meeting 19:30:33 <wilcal> so we wait on M6 and lets put some cycles into the updates list 19:30:55 <lewyssmith> 19168 got the better of me tonight. 19:31:26 <wilcal> Think of these things as potential career builders 19:31:42 <Akien> mhonarc works well for sympa on our infra, so IMO you could validate it as is 19:32:06 <lewyssmith> Would you like to? Seriously. 19:33:02 <lewyssmith> If not, I will do it on your word (which is in the bug). 19:33:25 <wilcal> Something ok'd as 64-bit can probably be moved along 19:33:41 <Akien> I can do it yes. 19:33:44 <lewyssmith> I did; good test of functionality at least. 19:34:11 <lewyssmith> Akien: TIA 19:35:43 <lewyssmith> I have been validating impossible things just on clean updates. 19:35:56 <wilcal> ok lets move on 19:35:58 <wilcal> #topic Anything Else? 19:36:04 <krisNL> how can we ever get a stabilized M6 version if the packagers keep submitting new packages, introducing new bugs? 19:36:35 <wilcal> time for a hard freeze but IMO developers love the new stuff 19:36:39 <bria_n> good question. how does that freeze get initiated experienced folks? 19:36:51 <wilcal> we need to move on to M7 to get them excited again 19:36:54 <lewyssmith> How many 'new' bugs are introduced, or were always there but not noticed? 19:37:08 <bria_n> libreoffice is an example 19:37:11 <bria_n> it wasn't doing that 19:37:13 <wilcal> The big chunks are behind us 19:37:23 <krisNL> at leat 2 critical, most likely by gtk3 and gnome stuff 19:37:32 <wilcal> i don't remember seeing the LO thing 19:37:40 <lewyssmith> Yet... 19:38:05 <lewyssmith> Benmc: Welcome, Ben. 19:38:29 <Benmc> Lewis, QA, good morning 19:38:48 <lewyssmith> Good morrow to you! 19:38:52 <wilcal> We're in the Anything else part of the meeting. Anything you want to add 19:39:14 <wilcal> m6 is kinda in wait due to some big bugs 19:39:38 <wilcal> discussion forum is down and that will ultimately hold up of M6 final release 19:39:52 <tarazed> Generally in good shape though 19:40:04 <wilcal> m6 is kinda in wait due to some big bugs 19:40:18 <wilcal> Yes, M6 is very usable for most of us 19:40:34 <wilcal> this laptop I am using now is an example 19:40:40 <Benmc> pretty good shape. just finishing option 3 of an upgrade types. see how it goes 19:41:11 <wilcal> Upgrading from M5 -> M6 is very problemistic 19:41:20 <lewyssmith> Not always, Bill. 19:41:21 <wilcal> may in some cases not be overcomable 19:41:38 <wilcal> correct some folks may never see a problem 19:41:43 <Benmc> using on-line cauldron media and upgrading a running system 19:41:58 <wilcal> KDE -> Plasma is kinda like walking the plank 19:42:20 <lewyssmith> Benmc: How many pkgs? 19:42:20 <Benmc> not if it is part af a multi DE install 19:42:32 <Benmc> 2800 something 19:42:40 <wilcal> Some folks have reported as many as 4000 rpms in the upgrade 19:42:47 <wilcal> I'm seeing over 3000 19:43:02 <lewyssmith> Benmc: A lot. Tell me how you get on. 19:43:22 <Benmc> ok 19:43:43 <wilcal> Consider it an adventure 19:43:58 <lewyssmith> To drive you spare if it fails. 19:44:11 <Benmc> hasnt yet 19:44:31 <lewyssmith> Does this mean a stable mirror? 19:44:40 <Benmc> you bet 19:44:54 <wilcal> I should do an M5 Xfce to M6 Xfce upgrade and see how well that does 19:45:04 <lewyssmith> Benmc: Maybe I should try it. 19:45:30 <Benmc> i will send you a tip or two 19:45:39 <tarazed> I did a couple - no problems - no extra media 19:45:55 <wilcal> Note I rsync to mirrors.kernel.org ( in that process twice ) every morning at 4AM and don't make any changes to my local repo unless it really needs it 19:46:13 <wilcal> so I rsync and 5-min later rsync again 19:46:31 <lewyssmith> tarazed: So you will reply to my latest post about this? 19:46:48 <bria_n> mine have been lucky with those upgrades, from classic dvd 19:46:49 <wilcal> that's mid morning in Europe and the repo tends to be pretty quite then 19:46:56 <tarazed> Sure. Have not seen it yet. 19:47:05 <lewyssmith> bria_n: With addeed media? 19:48:07 <bria_n> nothing exotic, except owncloud and ftp services 19:48:16 <wilcal> Anything else folks 19:48:29 <lewyssmith> Benmc: -n You have already primed me with info, which I appreciate. 19:48:43 <lewyssmith> No more here. 19:48:51 <krisNL> no 19:48:53 <tarazed> Nowt 19:48:55 <wilcal> nor from me 19:49:11 <wilcal> T-5 19:49:15 <lewyssmith> Thanks to those who came, to Bill for chairing. goodbye all. 19:49:19 <wilcal> T-4 19:49:24 <wilcal> T-3 19:49:25 <wilcal> bye all 19:49:26 <tarazed> So long 19:49:30 <wilcal> t_2 19:49:34 <wilcal> T-1 19:49:39 <wilcal> #endmeeting