19:35:52 <ennael> #startmeeting 19:35:52 <Inigo_Montoya`> Meeting started Mon Apr 28 19:35:52 2014 UTC. The chair is ennael. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:35:52 <Inigo_Montoya`> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 19:35:58 <leuhmanu> ok 19:36:04 <ennael> hi all thanks for being there tonight 19:36:29 <MrsB> nice to see so many here 19:36:31 <tmb> hi 19:36:44 <DavidWHodgins> HiYa 19:36:59 <ennael> ok first topic then :) 19:37:08 <ennael> #topic review of financial needs for coming year 19:37:55 <DavidWHodgins> Why hasn't valstar been replaced? I thought that was already aproved. 19:37:59 <ennael> so the question was started last meeting to try to estimate what would be the specific needs to be planned this year 19:38:16 <ennael> can we do it team by team? 19:38:23 <Akien> Fine by me 19:38:32 <ennael> who wants to start :) 19:38:49 <MrsB> I can if you like 19:38:52 <DavidWHodgins> Qa team just needs people, not money. 19:39:22 <doktor5000_> forums team too - but not that much 19:39:26 <ennael> ok MrsB 19:39:27 <DavidWHodgins> Sorry MrsB 19:39:54 <doktor5000_> sorry MrsB 19:40:02 <Schultz> hey everyone 19:40:06 <MrsB> We discussed it in our last meeting and the only thing really would be automating some of the testing. There are various ways to do this though and certainly at the moment .. 19:41:17 <MrsB> there is not enough manpower to impliment a server based solution. Any automation would therefore most likely be VM based on our own machines. That too requires manpower to impliment though so at the moment it's all a bit of a pipedream. 19:42:03 <ennael> so to sum up a server dedicated to automatic tests for virtual environements 19:42:09 <MrsB> We're quickly reaching a position of needing to increase contributors, or increse automation in order to keep pace with growth 19:42:27 <wilcal> Better late then never 19:42:56 <tmb> the trouble with "server dedicated" is that we are running out of rack space at the DC too :/ 19:43:01 <MrsB> We're not sure actually Anne. We'd *like* to get some automation in place but there are various methods to doing so and not enough manpower to implement any of it at the moment anyway 19:43:25 <ennael> tmb: even if we replace current server that take a lot of place with more powerfull and small one ? 19:45:06 <MrsB> I wouldn't want to dedicate a seerver to the task and have it sit there unused, but ideally I thiink the ultimate solution would be to have something which ties in with the build system and automates some regression testing 19:45:13 <tmb> ennael, well, we should reserve that space for an UPS to shield atleast valstar (svn/git/repo/...), alamut (sql+ wiki + foruom) and maybe fiona (backup) 19:45:14 <Akien> So IIUC QA would not need particular investments for now, but maybe some resources on existing machines to starting playing with automation technologies? 19:45:39 <Akien> s/starting/start/ 19:45:42 <ennael> rabbit may help but it will need some more disk space 19:45:42 <tmb> ennael, we have had way to much power issues lately at the dc 19:46:11 <wilcal> Sorry "DC"?? 19:46:17 <leuhmanu> datacenter 19:46:23 <wilcal> LOcated at? 19:46:26 <MrsB> wilcal: hi btw 19:46:29 <ennael> Marseille 19:46:31 <leuhmanu> marseille south france 19:46:32 <wilcal> Hi MrsB 19:46:32 <ennael> south of France 19:46:45 <filip_> hi there 19:46:53 <MrsB> and filip_ hi :) 19:46:58 <wilcal> Can anyone of the Mageia team reach out at touch that box in Marseille? 19:47:09 <Schultz> the nuclear wind hasn't been blowing strongly enough down south 19:47:16 <tmb> ennael, yes, we could beef up rabbit with more disks (wich we get when new valstar arrives), and it could do some QA work 19:47:24 <ennael> ok guys can we go back to subject :) 19:47:41 <ennael> tmb: yep so need is new disks 19:48:02 <ennael> #info QA team: plan more disk space rabbit to develop automatic tests 19:48:37 <MrsB> At least if there is space to experiment it's one les obstcal to doing so 19:48:42 <MrsB> obstical 19:48:44 <tmb> ennael, well, for infra we need new valstar, an UPS, and maybe a KVM-over-IP switch (or check what iDrac enterprise costs) 19:49:23 <ennael> ok can we have specific description and price ? 19:49:46 <leuhmanu> was the planned server not bought ? 19:49:48 <tmb> trouble is a new valstar is still requested new price / not ordered :/ 19:49:59 <leuhmanu> ok have my answer 19:50:03 <tmb> *still not* 19:50:09 <ennael> ok so I need to kick ass :) 19:50:33 <tmb> yep, I dont have long enough legs :) 19:50:47 <ennael> :) 19:50:57 <DavidWHodgins> lol 19:51:01 * Akien hands over a shield to coincoin. 19:53:10 <ennael> ok I will ping about this 19:53:13 * sebsebseb is here now 19:53:33 <ennael> tmb: any other needs for sysadmins ? 19:53:44 <ennael> you can list it's christmas :) 19:54:52 <tmb> well, there was some discussions about reworking the arm setuo, but I haven't heard from rtp lately 19:55:15 <ennael> ok 19:55:36 <tmb> anyway new valstar + ups + kvm will probably go between 4-7000 19:55:51 <MrsB> ouch 19:56:13 <tmb> looking on financial status in beginning of march this year we have ~14000 19:56:18 <ennael> yep 19:56:29 <MrsB> oh ok, doing alright at the moment then 19:56:40 <ennael> yep we do have regular donations 19:56:46 <ennael> and some are really nice one 19:57:05 <MrsB> in that case ... :D 19:57:10 <ennael> :) 19:57:16 <filip_> so we have an obligation to invest visely 19:57:21 <ennael> ok next one may be atelier 19:57:37 <ennael> grenoya sent an email about this 19:57:46 <ennael> grenoya: can you sum it up ? 19:57:53 <grenoya> yes 19:58:06 <MrsB> One more for QA might to be to get some uefi or nvidia/intel hardware for QA team testers for mga5, sorry for late suggestion 19:58:27 <ennael> MrsB: how would we manage this ? 19:59:00 <MrsB> In which way, maintaining ownership? 19:59:33 <doktor5000_> ennael: MrsB: attach a small htpc to the kvm-over-IP switch in the DC for central access? 20:00:51 <ennael> MrsB: who will get hardware for the tests ? 20:01:15 <Akien> MrsB: We already have quite a few contributors with UEFI and/or nvidia/intel hardware 20:01:23 <Akien> e.g. Stormi :-p 20:01:25 <Akien> (or me) 20:01:29 <MrsB> There are a number of regular testers who could use it 20:01:34 <MrsB> iso testing i mean 20:01:40 <sebsebseb> nice all the current QA team members are getting bought new WIndows 8 computers for UEFI tsting of Mageia, using the Magiea funding, awesome heh heh 20:01:46 <Akien> But more hardware is always better 20:01:56 <MrsB> If we have people who will test then that's fine 20:03:10 <grenoya> so, atelier asked some time ago some storage (git for marcom and artwork, ftp for web). But Coling and tmb have actions on that already 20:03:21 <MrsB> anyway, sorry to jump in again, we can can assess requirements at a later date, pleas go on 20:03:51 <tmb> well, an UEFI box can be built ~200€ 20:05:07 <tmb> grenoya, yep, I started on fixing up the storage but got sidetracked fixing up rabbit for iso builds... so it will take some more days to finish it up 20:05:28 <grenoya> tmb: thanks for the status :) 20:06:18 <grenoya> we were also thinking a testing web server would be nice and could be used also by i18n and doc teams 20:06:38 <grenoya> but we know it means work from sysadmins and council may not agree 20:07:01 <tmb> grenoya, yes, that sounds really useful... shouldn't be hard to setup 20:07:08 <filip_> there is actually http://www-test.mageia.org/ already 20:07:11 <ennael> you mean a virtual environment you could break as you want ? :) 20:07:22 <filip_> but empty 20:07:35 <grenoya> ennael: definitly something we could break as we want :) 20:07:50 <ennael> ok so it seems doable as said tmb 20:08:18 <grenoya> good :) 20:08:23 <grenoya> thanks 20:08:36 <tmb> indeed www-test is running on champagne... only downside it is not so big on storage, so depends what you want to test 20:09:21 <grenoya> first is www 20:09:56 <grenoya> maybe some other pages/apps we wants to work on (mirrors, doc...) 20:11:15 <grenoya> I think that's all for atelier's needs 20:11:26 <lebarhon> On MLO (French forum) people are asking themselves how to help QA 20:11:54 <leuhmanu> pleas go in #mageia-qa 20:12:17 <lebarhon> they don't speak English 20:12:43 <leuhmanu> anyway but we are in meeting, not related ;) 20:13:13 <ennael> grenoya: that would be great also to have some information about goodies and all this kind of stuff 20:13:53 <Akien> lebarhon: I think the simplest way (at first) would be to join #MLO and get help from leuhmanu, david_david or me 20:14:24 <grenoya> oops! forgot a bit of marcom part: "We would like a big event box full of Stuff" 20:14:32 <MrsB> \o/ 20:14:32 <ennael> :) 20:14:36 <grenoya> Trish did not give more information 20:14:49 <ennael> ok can you try to check with her about this ? 20:15:00 <grenoya> yes 20:15:14 <grenoya> will sent a mail about that 20:15:30 <ennael> thanks 20:15:38 <ennael> anything else ? 20:15:48 <DavidWHodgins> Yes 20:15:48 <ennael> (we do not pay for beers or vacations:p) 20:16:24 <Akien> Well i18n needs so money, only love :-) 20:16:31 <Akien> And fresh water 20:16:36 <Akien> s/so/no/ 20:16:51 <ennael> ok :) 20:16:54 <ennael> next topic then :) 20:16:58 <ennael> #topic coming events for Mageia 20:17:10 <ennael> a quick one about coming events 20:17:23 <ennael> so we have Solution Linux in Paris, end of may 20:17:51 <DavidWHodgins> I think for those who want paid support, we should encourage the pacakergs to fom a corporatioan, to proide the support, but also provide their updates to Magisa. 20:18:04 <sebsebseb> and the Berin one LInux Tag at begining of May, and I won't be going to either 20:18:55 <ennael> people here going to Linuxtag ? 20:19:24 <sebsebseb> actuall it seems Maiea may not get a presence this year at LInux Tag going by some emails I got before, but I can't tell you if that is realy the case or not 20:20:04 <ennael> well it's not in list of exhibitors on the web site 20:20:10 <leuhmanu> even Oliver and doktor5000_ ? 20:20:34 <tmb> didn't Oliver ask for more volunteers for it in order to register, but got no help :/ 20:20:34 <Akien> I think marja plans to go there 20:20:48 <leuhmanu> ah sorry to missed it 20:20:55 <sebsebseb> it seems the usal people were all having issues when it comes to attending that one 20:20:58 <Akien> At least she talked about Berlin, but maybe it was not for LinuxTag :-) 20:21:15 <sebsebseb> so it seems there may not be a Magiea stand, but you have to ask Oliver etc, to find out for sure 20:21:44 <sebsebseb> Akien: yes that would have been LInux Tag 20:23:25 <tmb> Looking on the mail from March 17th, it was LinuxTag, and since no-one else could help, booth was not requested 20:23:56 <ennael> ok 20:24:02 <ennael> any other event planned ? 20:24:18 <DavidWHodgins> Have to go. Bye for now. 20:24:31 <ennael> oh we will have a talk from coling in Distro Recipes in PAris in June 20:24:57 <doktor5000_> besides, LinuxTag changed locations, and is now in parallel to two other fairs ... 20:25:16 <sebsebseb> there's always things like OGG Camp coming up later on in the year, the biggeest UK open source free software free culuture event, but no Mageia stands panned for that as far as I know, even though it's free to have a stand there. openSUSE had in 2012, Fedora had in 2013 20:25:35 <sebsebseb> so wasted oppertunity really not having a presence 20:25:42 <ennael> sebsebseb: if you volunteer let's go 20:26:17 <ennael> ok next topic then 20:26:20 <ennael> #topic blog posts 20:26:46 <ennael> so we really need to publish new articles on our blog 20:27:20 <ennael> https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Blog_articles_planning 20:27:23 <ennael> as a reminder 20:27:26 <wilcal> Many thanks to MrsB for pubishing that Heartbleed notice 20:27:27 <MrsB> we were going to do a series of articles about each of the teams 20:27:51 <Akien> BTW about our article on Heartbleed, I think it would have been nice to specify that Mageia servers were not affected (and thus identity accounts not compromised) 20:28:07 <Akien> I added a line about it in the French translation 20:28:25 <MrsB> I purposely didn't mention them as we're a bit outdated and it's probably not best to publicise that 20:29:46 <doktor5000_> MrsB: most of the unaffected distros also use openssl 0.9.8 or 1.0, so no issue with that ... 20:30:13 <MrsB> it's more the other stuff which might be outdated, I think some are still mga1 20:30:21 <Akien> Yes, that's true. Though more than 2 years old is not _that_ old for servers I suppose (provided security fixes are cherry-picked...) 20:30:48 <Akien> Even mdv2010 I think for valstar before it was upgraded :) 20:30:54 <sebsebseb> MrsB: yeah altough it shows it's running old stuff, when know where to look :d and right on it 20:31:05 <MrsB> yes, there are no sec updates for those 20:31:54 <MrsB> it can be added though if there is a desire for it 20:33:12 <Akien> MrsB: Well, your point is correct, so I don't think it's that important to talk about outdated servers finally :-) 20:33:56 <tmb> Well, actually we have pushed some security updates directly through infra buildsystem and puppet config changes and restricted other services... 20:35:01 <Akien> Yes I'm pretty confident that we have solid servers. 20:35:02 <tmb> so a "semi-LTS" on our servers, especially for remote exploits... 20:35:12 <Akien> That might do a nice blog post by the way :-D 20:35:19 <MrsB> Ok, good to know. That's the reason I didn't mention it anyway 20:36:00 <tmb> "hey we have a semi-LTS, but you cant get it :)" 20:36:51 <filip_> "but you can maintain it" 20:36:57 <filip_> ;) 20:37:08 <MrsB> kind of mageia from scratch 20:37:47 <ennael> ok so back to blog posts ? :) 20:38:18 <MrsB> we should work on the teams thing 20:39:15 <MrsB> explain what each team does, what talents people need to join them, how to get involved, what to expect, etc 20:39:51 <MrsB> humanise mageia to our users who may think you need to be a tech head to help out 20:40:01 <Akien> Yes that would be nice 20:40:33 <ennael> ok so can you all explain it in your teams so that we can start this kind of post ? 20:40:51 <Akien> We've spoken about a blog post to announce our Transifex translation platform, so we could embed it in an overall i18n presentation post 20:40:53 <MrsB> one such post for each team 20:41:05 <ennael> yep 20:42:16 <filip_> Akien: good idea 20:42:42 <Akien> I think filip_ and I can work out a draft over the next two weeks or so 20:42:44 <Akien> filip_: WDYT? 20:43:05 <filip_> I think we should try 20:45:26 <MrsB> it's something we could redo from time to time 20:46:07 <ennael> ok so please keep us informed on council ML sot that we know what is about to be published 20:46:09 <Akien> Yes we've done call to arms during the previous release cycles, but we can try a more complete introduction to what each team does 20:47:10 <MrsB> yeah, to people outside who maybe haven't even thought of contributing. Make it human, so people realise mageia is made by people just like them 20:47:39 <MrsB> it's not a product pushed out by a faceless corporation 20:48:38 <Akien> Indeed, I just had to show a few tricks to Aranud from the MLO community during an event, and now he's started doing QA :) 20:49:12 <MrsB> he's doing well too 20:49:15 <Akien> We just have to make it clear that contributing just means opening the door, and asking "hi there? how can I help?" 20:49:31 <Akien> And coming back the next day, too :-) 20:49:35 <MrsB> yes, and why we need them to 20:50:03 <MrsB> i feel alot of users think of linux as a product now, rather than a project 20:50:54 <wilcal> Many people think "Linux" is a company 20:51:09 <ennael> that's also why they wait more for a ready to use product 20:51:11 <wilcal> "Linux should advertise more" is a common comment 20:51:26 <MrsB> yeah, it's up to us to show them 20:51:40 <wilcal> Linux is now the most widely used OS just people don't know that 20:52:10 <wilcal> Over 1 million new Linux web surfing platforms are shipped every day and growing 20:52:38 <MrsB> that's alot of potential contributors, we just need to find a handful really 20:53:59 <MrsB> if any other major sec updates occur we can do a short blog about those too 20:54:35 <wilcal> Kudos to the entire Mageia community for the response to Heartbleed 20:55:31 <ennael> anything else on that topic? 20:56:59 <sebsebseb> no 20:58:01 <ennael> I guess everybody is falling asleep. Shall we stop for tonight? 20:58:13 <Akien> Maybe an #action about each team having to prepare a blog post about its work? 20:58:35 <wilcal> I need to exit also 20:58:43 <MrsB> Nite wilcal 20:58:51 <wilcal> Nite all 20:59:59 <MrsB> We do need to discuss commercial stuff but here/now is not the time 21:00:11 <MrsB> maybe start with board 21:00:52 <ennael> yep I will setup epoll tomorrow morning as I have no news from oliver 21:01:20 <MrsB> that'll get things moving again 21:01:24 <ennael> yep 21:01:31 <ennael> it's a pain at the moment :) 21:01:40 <ennael> ok so thanks for attending this meeting 21:01:45 <ennael> see you in 2 weeks 21:01:49 <MrsB> thanks ennael 21:01:53 <ennael> #endmeeting