19:02:34 <ennael> #startmeeting 19:02:34 <Inigo_Montoya> Meeting started Mon Apr 2 19:02:34 2012 UTC. The chair is ennael. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:02:34 <Inigo_Montoya> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 19:02:39 <ennael> #chair obgr_seneca 19:02:39 <Inigo_Montoya> Current chairs: ennael obgr_seneca 19:03:02 <ennael> #topic local communities organization 19:03:08 <ennael> obgr_seneca: your turn :) 19:03:14 <obgr_seneca> Ok 19:03:41 <obgr_seneca> Well, there was a (short) discussion about it on the council ml 19:03:58 <obgr_seneca> and I think the best solution was the one boklm posted: 19:04:55 <obgr_seneca> Taking "local" as the short name, "Local Community Team" as the long one and local-discuss for the ml 19:05:08 <obgr_seneca> Anybody arguing against it? 19:05:15 <ennael> nope 19:05:15 <marja> no 19:05:53 <sebsebseb> that's like Ubuntu I think 19:06:09 <obgr_seneca> nope, Ubuntu uses "loco" 19:06:18 <sebsebseb> well yeah for short instead of saying loco 19:06:21 <ennael> #action "local" wiil be the short name, "Local Community Team" as the long one and local-discuss for the ml 19:06:22 <sebsebseb> uh local 19:06:42 <obgr_seneca> Ok, then I would need that ml and then I will contact the teams I know about 19:06:50 <ennael> boklm: ping ? 19:07:26 <boklm> ennael: pong 19:07:37 <obgr_seneca> boklm: we would need an ml 19:07:39 <ennael> can you have a look ? 19:07:40 <boklm> ok 19:07:53 <sebsebseb> I would still call it a UK users community, rather than a local users community for example, but for the mailing lists and such that works using local 19:08:17 <boklm> I will add the mailing list 19:08:30 <obgr_seneca> sebsebseb: this is about the team connecting the single existing local communities 19:08:39 <sebsebseb> obgr_seneca: yep :) 19:08:44 <obgr_seneca> not about a name for the single teams 19:08:48 <sebsebseb> yep 19:09:04 <obgr_seneca> I'm quite sure the french will keep their name of mlo e.g. 19:09:31 <ennael> as blogdrake 19:09:50 <obgr_seneca> in some time (perhaps a week or two) it would be good to have a portal page 19:09:59 <sebsebseb> agreed 19:10:09 <obgr_seneca> I will work on that and I would suggest local.mageia.org for it 19:10:27 <sebsebseb> good suggestion 19:11:12 <obgr_seneca> rda: I'd like to show you my ideas about the portal page then, would that be ok? 19:11:49 <obgr_seneca> #action boklm create the ml 19:12:12 <obgr_seneca> #action obgr_seneca create a portal page and contact the existing communities 19:12:24 <obgr_seneca> anything to add? 19:12:40 <sebsebseb> nope 19:12:41 <marja> not here 19:12:50 <ennael> nope 19:12:58 <coincoin> no 19:13:02 <rda_> obgr_seneca: sure 19:13:10 <obgr_seneca> ok 19:13:16 <ennael> next topic ? 19:13:17 <rda_> obgr_seneca: are you available tomorrow for that? or later this evening 19:13:35 <obgr_seneca> let's say tommorow 19:14:46 <obgr_seneca> ennael: next? 19:14:54 <ennael> yep 19:14:59 <ennael> #topic Forums 19:15:33 <obgr_seneca> so, there were some changes as I read on the syysadmin ml 19:15:41 <obgr_seneca> rda: I think you did some things there 19:15:42 <obgr_seneca> ? 19:16:48 <ennael> rda_ is not that available tonight he told me 19:17:04 <obgr_seneca> ah ok, but I don't know about the status 19:17:27 <ennael> argh 19:17:37 <ennael> boklm: any clue on that subject? 19:17:43 <boklm> there is not a lot of changes yet I think 19:18:06 <obgr_seneca> We should talk to the people involved in the forums 19:18:14 * boklm plans to look at forum upgrade, but not done yet 19:18:32 <marja> boklm: what is it still needed for? 19:18:32 <obgr_seneca> That would mean isadora and doktor5000 on the moderators part 19:18:57 <boklm> marja: to test it, and do it 19:18:58 <obgr_seneca> And ask Maat how he sees his future position 19:19:31 <marja> boklm: I don't understand 19:20:00 <marja> boklm: first it was for security issues.... but they don't exist, as wobo found out 19:20:18 <boklm> marja: there is new version of phpbb available 19:20:35 <boklm> for bugfix 19:20:40 <marja> boklm: there is a new bugzilla too, and that does fix security issues 19:21:06 <marja> boklm: one of those issues was already reported in august 19:21:17 <ennael> please can we go back to subject 19:21:23 <marja> ennael: OK 19:21:29 <ennael> so about forums 19:21:47 <ennael> we need to close that topic with clear decisions 19:22:05 <obgr_seneca> as I understand it, the technical side of the forums administration will be in sysadmin team 19:22:32 <obgr_seneca> the organizational side with the people working in the forums 19:22:39 <ennael> yep 19:22:51 <boklm> do we know who will be working on organizational side ? 19:22:57 <obgr_seneca> so we can focus on the organizatorial part here? 19:23:31 <obgr_seneca> I asked isadora and doktor5000 and they agreed to take moderator positions 19:23:41 <boklm> ok 19:23:55 <ennael> ok fine 19:24:02 <obgr_seneca> isadora already is moderator and doktor5000 is the most active man we have in there 19:24:27 <marja> yep 19:24:32 <obgr_seneca> And I think they can choose others by peer recognition, if others are needed 19:24:58 <obgr_seneca> I would talk to germ (who is also moderator but hasn't been active for weeks) 19:25:14 <obgr_seneca> And remove all other moderators since they never have been active 19:25:18 <ennael> #info the technical side of the forums administration will be in sysadmin team and isadora and doktor5000 agreed to take moderator positions 19:25:58 <ennael> #info cleaning will be done in moderators sot that they are now chosen by peer recognition if needed 19:27:16 <obgr_seneca> the question remains how we integrate the forums into the overall Mageia structure 19:27:50 <obgr_seneca> And if and what Maat wants to do in the future, but I have no contact with him 19:28:18 <ennael> about integration il would be nice to have a representative in council 19:28:27 <ennael> as other local communities 19:28:43 <ennael> they do have lots of people behind and we need feedback 19:28:52 <obgr_seneca> you think as part of the "Local communities team"? 19:29:02 <obgr_seneca> Or as a separate representative? 19:29:02 <ennael> yep 19:29:09 <ennael> well 19:29:20 <ennael> all in all it does not really matter I guess 19:29:27 <marja> obgr_seneca: did you ping him on IRC? 19:29:40 <obgr_seneca> marja: whom? 19:29:45 <marja> maat 19:29:45 <sebsebseb> yep someone could be responislbe for the local community teams, or maybe even for all teams? make sure everyone is doing the right thing, and so on 19:30:11 <marja> obgr_seneca: Maât, you said you have no contact with him 19:30:15 <obgr_seneca> marja: no, but I haven't seen him for a while (due to not being that much online lately) 19:30:36 <marja> obgr_seneca: he left at the beginning of this meeting :þ 19:31:19 <marja> obgr_seneca: on workdays he is usually online from late in the morning till not so late in the evening 19:32:15 <ennael> do we need anything else ? 19:32:21 <obgr_seneca> I can try and contact him, but I don't really know him, so I would prefer someone else to do it 19:32:30 <marja> obgr_seneca: OK, I'll do it 19:32:39 <obgr_seneca> marja: thx 19:32:51 <obgr_seneca> about council representatives: 19:32:58 <marja> obgr_seneca: np, just mail me exactly what you want to know 19:33:39 <sebsebseb> hi Max__ :) 19:33:40 <Max__> Hi guys, sorry I'm late. Real life got in the way. 19:33:44 <obgr_seneca> I would actually add two: one representing the international forums and one for the local communities 19:33:46 <marja> Max__: hi 19:33:48 <obgr_seneca> Hi marja 19:33:49 <sebsebseb> Max__: good to see you here :) 19:33:52 <obgr_seneca> Hi Max__ 19:33:59 <ennael> obgr_seneca: yep sure 19:34:20 <sebsebseb> obgr_seneca: I nearly messaged marja by mistake there as well :D 19:34:30 <ennael> anything else ? 19:34:32 <obgr_seneca> ok, I will report back on this in one or twoi days, ok? 19:34:40 <ennael> yep 19:34:42 <ennael> thanks for that 19:36:23 <obgr_seneca> so next topic? 19:36:28 <sebsebseb> yep 19:36:50 <ennael> #topic Mageia 2 artwork 19:37:07 <ennael> ok 19:37:18 <ennael> there were some mails today about artwork 19:37:58 <ennael> sorry if some of you felt frustrated or upset 19:38:18 <ennael> but the thing is planning is nearly done 19:38:25 <ennael> we had deadlines for a while 19:38:30 <sebsebseb> yep I read those emails :) 19:38:49 <ennael> making a release is very stressfull thing 19:38:57 <ennael> and at one time we need to take decisions 19:39:16 * coling nods (hello btw) 19:39:22 <marja> coling: hi 19:39:26 <ennael> being on time for release is important 19:39:30 <sebsebseb> oh coling is here now as well, hello 19:39:43 <ennael> as it shows we as a project are able to be organized and make this together 19:39:53 <sebsebseb> yep 19:39:56 <ennael> that's why it was a bit rude but needed 19:40:17 <ennael> at one moment also inside team leaders need to cut discussion 19:40:22 <ennael> take decision 19:40:38 <ennael> I personnally thought it was going to happen soon 19:40:43 <ennael> but still nothing for now 19:41:41 <Max__> Well, we did that. We made decisions. But every decision I had made in the past month has been overruled by council members showing up late for the discussion. How do you think that makes me feel? 19:41:48 <Max__> How do you think that makes the team feel? 19:42:12 <Max__> We already chased one designer away beause if that, and I'm afraid that Guala is leaving the team as well. 19:42:19 <ennael> countdown has now started and we need to close planning 19:42:19 <ennael> so work is not lost at all 19:42:20 <ennael> we will improve things and improve cross team work 19:42:20 <ennael> so Max__ don't be frustrated :) 19:42:20 <ennael> let focus on things we have to finalize 19:42:44 <sebsebseb> Max__: Gaula is leaving oh? 19:42:49 <ennael> wait 19:43:20 <ennael> we already told several times for example logo could not be modified for design 19:43:34 <Max__> Water under the bridge. Let's move on. 19:43:53 <ennael> so for sure what will be needed not to have this again 19:44:03 <ennael> - improve communication 19:44:14 <ennael> - finalize charte for logo and design 19:44:37 <ennael> I guess it can be our priorities after Mageia 2 is out 19:45:16 <Max__> And a schedule. We need a much more specific schedule. Ambigous dates like "Artwork freeze March 10" isn't good enough. 19:45:32 <ennael> well it's not ambigous 19:45:45 <obgr_seneca> Well what'S ambiguous about a freeze? 19:45:48 <ennael> freeze is freeze :) 19:46:02 <ennael> meaning having everything ready 19:46:13 <Max__> Yes. But what needs to be done beefore the freeze? What is the SLA on bug reports? What should our priorities be? 19:46:29 <ennael> ? 19:46:43 <obgr_seneca> SLA? 19:47:08 <Max__> Could be a local term, it's how we catogorize and prioritize our work in the IT dept. where I work. 19:47:16 <ennael> oh 19:47:30 <ennael> well freeze is delivering pieces of artwork 19:47:35 <ennael> then integration is done 19:47:39 <sebsebseb> yep 19:47:56 <sebsebseb> the freeze is meant to be a final deadline for something, but sometimes delays happen 19:48:01 <ennael> if things are not clear enough just ask 19:48:19 <ennael> we are here to improve things together 19:49:05 <ennael> but for sure todo list is still huge 19:49:21 <marja> https://bugs.mageia.org/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED&priority=release_blocker&query_format=advanced&order=bug_id%20DESC&query_based_on= 19:49:28 <ennael> we should have backgrounds, boot, mcc and installer ready 19:49:31 <ennael> for RC 19:50:01 <marja> hi trishf42 19:50:03 <sebsebseb> hi trishf42 19:50:13 <Max__> Installer got shot out of the water. Twice. We won't have that. Just plain od screenshots. 19:50:16 <trishf42> hi marja, sebsebseb 19:50:26 <ennael> on that last items we nearly need a daily report 19:50:32 <Max__> And excellent texts from marcom. 19:50:36 <ennael> installer => left background 19:50:45 <obgr_seneca> Hi trishf42 19:50:49 <trishf42> hi obgr_seneca 19:51:08 <trishf42> sorry I'm late, it's only 05:50 here... 19:51:16 <sebsebseb> trishf42: no problem :) 19:51:17 <Max__> Yeah, schultz said he had nearly finished with plymouth and ksplash. The backgrounds aparently need more haggling over the logo. He never got back to me about draktools. 19:51:29 <sebsebseb> trishf42: you know I don't mind covering for you anyway :) 19:51:41 <ennael> drakxtools and installer are not that hard 19:51:50 <ennael> I guess having a part of backgrounbd should do the trick 19:52:04 <Max__> Yup. But it still takes someone with the know-how to do it. 19:53:01 <ennael> well size is on wiki 19:53:12 <ennael> it's just a plain image with fixed resolution 19:53:54 <ennael> let me look for it 19:54:08 <ennael> Max__: I can mail all information about it ok ? 19:54:13 <Max__> 196x600 19:54:35 <Max__> Please. 19:54:43 <ennael> ok I will do 19:54:58 <ennael> #action ennael will mail information about installer and mcc backgrounds 19:55:46 <Max__> I would to come out of this with a concrete understanding of just what is and what is not acceptable to do to the Mageia logo so we can finally finish up with the background. 19:55:53 <ennael> Max__: can I ask you to mail council about progress as soon as there are some ? 19:56:02 <Max__> I will gladly do that. 19:56:06 <ennael> thanks a lot 19:56:12 <ennael> that will avoid stress :) 19:56:27 <obgr_seneca> ennael: Max__ still needs write permission on the council ml 19:56:40 <ennael> RC is planned for tuesday we can delay 1 or 2 days but having artwork would be great 19:56:53 <ennael> boklm: can you have a look for Max__ ? 19:57:03 <obgr_seneca> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5202 19:57:15 <boklm> ok 19:57:31 <Max__> So let's talk logo. How much can we change the colors? 19:58:21 <ennael> I guess it can be colours one as on web sites for example 19:58:26 <ennael> or black or white 19:58:44 <Max__> Grayscale? 19:58:47 <obgr_seneca> pperhaps one in greyscale as well? 20:00:22 * ennael is not the best one to speak about this 20:00:31 * obgr_seneca neither 20:00:34 <marja> no problem for me.. but I missed all the decisions about this in the past 20:00:36 <ennael> but make proposal quickly on coucil 20:00:49 <ennael> just now by mail for example 20:00:53 <ennael> we will find a solution 20:01:00 <ennael> Max__: ok ? 20:01:07 <Max__> OK 20:01:11 <ennael> thanks 20:01:37 <ennael> any other comment, question on that topic ? 20:01:58 <ennael> #action Max__ will report on council ML progress as soon as there are some 20:02:15 <trishf42> we need to complete the style sheet - and include standard artwork as part of it, 20:02:23 <ennael> yep 20:02:27 <trishf42> so that everyone knows what sort of thing is expected. 20:02:47 <trishf42> After release, first thing, we can help with that 20:02:56 <ennael> sure 20:02:58 * trishf42 means marcom, not the royal we 20:03:04 <ennael> :)) 20:03:16 <ennael> last topic ? 20:03:31 <obgr_seneca> yep 20:03:41 <ennael> #topic Mageia 2 release planning 20:03:50 <ennael> ok a good one to end... :) 20:04:36 <ennael> so mainly the point in the 2/3 coming days is to evaluate wether we keep the current planning or we add some more days for release_blockers bugs 20:05:19 <ennael> I started having a look today, I should be able to propose a status tomorrow or wednesday 20:05:26 <marja> good 20:05:30 <coling> That sounds good ennael 20:05:38 <ennael> better to take 2 weeks more rather than releasing buggy one 20:05:42 <ennael> ah coling :) 20:05:49 <coling> I think I'm mostly happy with the way things are, but there are some issues that might be tricky. 20:05:53 <obgr_seneca> +1 20:06:01 <ennael> ok 20:06:11 <coling> I'll try and sort out an "issues list" from the systemd/dracut perspective. 20:06:17 <coling> Things people can help testing with etc. 20:06:18 <ennael> so I will spam bugzilla in coming hours 20:06:25 <ennael> yep that could be great 20:06:46 <ennael> still we also need news from tmb for live isos 20:06:48 <coling> I've thankfully closed off a lot of systemd bugs of late and tried to rationalise the ones that are more niggles than real bugs. 20:07:00 <ennael> thanks for that 20:07:24 <leuhmanu> maybe we can postpone only the live ? (and the dual) 20:07:43 <ennael> well we did it during all dev planning 20:07:43 <obgr_seneca> we will get a lot of fire for that 20:07:54 <obgr_seneca> better postpone the whole release... 20:07:57 <ennael> people now will not believe such announcement :) 20:08:00 <ennael> yep 20:08:08 <leuhmanu> ok indeed 20:08:16 <coling> Yeah I agree. 20:08:19 <marja> I agree.... better to postpone everything 20:08:32 <coincoin> +1 20:08:45 <obgr_seneca> Are there any news from tmb? I haven't read from him in some time 20:08:48 <coling> What is the current hold up with live stuff? I've not been following super closely, but if I can help, I shall. 20:08:48 <ennael> #action final status on release planning will be given on wednesday 20:09:01 <coincoin> obgr_seneca: he just commited tonight so he seems to be bacj 20:09:02 <ennael> coling: I guess it was about dracut integration 20:09:03 <coincoin> back 20:09:10 * coling thought as much. 20:09:18 <coling> Well, if I can help there I surely will. 20:09:26 <marja> thx coling 20:09:30 <coling> If you see tmb, tell him to poke me. 20:09:31 <ennael> I will mail tmb, blino and coling then about this 20:10:01 <ennael> again taking 2 more weeks for live cds is doable, not end of the world :) 20:10:26 <ennael> so status will be taken during packagers meeting ok ? 20:10:26 <leuhmanu> but we need real test of users too :/ 20:10:53 <obgr_seneca> it would be great if we could release before LinuxTag though.... 20:10:53 <ennael> leuhmanu: we will organize this for live cds 20:11:08 <ennael> obgr_seneca: we will try... what's the date? 20:11:18 <obgr_seneca> end of May 20:11:21 <ennael> ok 20:11:35 <leuhmanu> (I mean not only in the QA) 20:11:43 <ennael> coling: can you attend packagers meeting wednesday ? 20:11:48 <obgr_seneca> 23rd till 26th of may 20:12:02 <coling> ennael, what time? 20:12:04 <ennael> leuhmanu: yep we can organize specific opened test days 20:12:05 <coling> 8 UTC? 20:12:16 <ennael> coling: 7 UTC 20:12:24 <coling> so 8 BST... 20:12:28 <coling> Should be OK yeah 20:12:34 <ennael> great thanks :) 20:13:39 <ennael> trishf42: what about marcom side ? 20:14:05 <trishf42> what do you need from us? 20:14:19 <ennael> well announcement and so 20:14:22 <trishf42> we've got some work in progress for the release texts, 20:14:27 <ennael> oh great 20:14:34 <trishf42> and we'll have something to show by next meeting 20:14:42 <ennael> ok 20:14:46 <trishf42> and we will get the matches out if ppl don't read them and comment! 20:14:55 <trishf42> 8-) 20:14:57 <ennael> :)) 20:16:03 <ennael> #action marcom will propose first texts during next meeting 20:16:21 <trishf42> they're going to be on the sandbox in the wiki page, so ppl can go in there and comment anytime 20:16:45 <ennael> ok 20:18:02 <ennael> anything else ? 20:18:24 <marja> not now 20:18:27 <trishf42> not from me 20:18:34 <coincoin> no 20:19:08 <obgr_seneca> nor from me 20:19:14 <ennael> ok thanks for attending :) 20:19:21 <ennael> #endmeeting