17:32:10 <obgr_seneca> #startmeeting 17:32:10 <Inigo_Montoya> Meeting started Thu Aug 2 17:32:10 2012 UTC. The chair is obgr_seneca. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:32:10 <Inigo_Montoya> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 17:32:22 <obgr_seneca> Hi everyone and welcome to i18n meeting 17:32:54 <obgr_seneca> As I said in the mail I'd like to propose a short status meeting only 17:33:20 <obgr_seneca> Because I have to finish my thesis till end of August and thus I am a bit busy... 17:33:28 <obgr_seneca> #topic website status 17:33:46 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: would you want to give us a bit of information? 17:34:18 <filip_k> there is not much to report besides info I already gave on ML 17:34:42 <filip_k> I'm willing to continue but I would like some sugestions 17:35:02 <obgr_seneca> suggestions about what? 17:35:07 <filip_k> and maybe some more feedback 17:35:26 <filip_k> about what pages we should convert first 17:35:36 <obgr_seneca> From my point of view, it's great what you are doing 17:35:44 <obgr_seneca> What pages do we have left? 17:36:05 <obgr_seneca> I think the 1/ pages have low priority, most people won't go there nowadays 17:36:41 <filip_k> I don't have an exact report about that but I can come back in 3 minutes with something 17:36:50 <obgr_seneca> would be good 17:36:52 <obgr_seneca> About those check pages, yurchor what does not work? 17:37:04 <filip_k> Remi asked about changing one string 17:37:32 <yurchor> obgr_seneca: On report page: http://www.mageia.org/langs/report.php 17:37:49 <obgr_seneca> yurchor: that's a bit ambiguos... 17:38:09 <obgr_seneca> check page leads you to the page in your locale so you can see if everything is all right 17:38:24 <filip_k> I didn't convert that page. I'm trying to include as much as possible to lang files as that offers us flexibility 17:38:27 <yurchor> Wait... Click on "check page" in the CoC or Values column for the ready translations. 17:38:44 <obgr_seneca> if you want to have the report about a page, you have to click the "foo missing" thing 17:39:08 <filip_k> if we agree I can do some changes on older lang files but that will mark some string untranslated 17:39:12 <yurchor> obgr_seneca: Ok. But if I want to check page? 17:39:28 <yurchor> Other pages are working. 17:39:48 <filip_k> you can check page by normal browsing 17:39:50 <obgr_seneca> yurchor: let's take the code of conduct 17:40:08 <obgr_seneca> you get a 404 :-/ 17:40:11 <obgr_seneca> I see... 17:40:20 <filip_k> only pages below /en/about/ don't work 17:40:34 <yurchor> A-ha... Thanks. 17:41:02 <filip_k> I can take a look in the following days as this is not big deal really 17:41:34 <obgr_seneca> I asked rda to join us, perhaps he has some information... 17:42:08 <filip_k> please discuss about those changes of strings as I look for pages to translate 17:42:18 <obgr_seneca> we will do... 17:42:25 <filip_k> I'll report later 17:43:25 <obgr_seneca> so let's see, what Akien wanted to change... 17:45:01 <obgr_seneca> I'd say best we make 3 strings out of it 17:45:05 <obgr_seneca> Subversion 17:45:08 <obgr_seneca> Git 17:45:10 <obgr_seneca> and 17:45:23 <obgr_seneca> -Code-Repositories 17:45:35 <obgr_seneca> so we don't have any html tags in them 17:45:46 <obgr_seneca> yurchor: any thoughts about it? 17:46:39 <yurchor> I don't know how it works, maybe some linebreaking can help? 17:47:00 <obgr_seneca> good question... 17:47:15 <yurchor> Or strip some formatting... 17:47:29 <Qilaq> hi, and sorry for being late 17:47:34 <obgr_seneca> If I read Akien's mail correctly, the problem is the html tag in Git</a>-Code-Repositories 17:47:37 <obgr_seneca> Hi Qilaq 17:48:24 <Qilaq> If the question is what pages should be (more) prioritized then maybe reports and its subpages - money is the ting people are always interested of :-) 17:48:44 <obgr_seneca> Qilaq: good thinking! 17:50:11 <obgr_seneca> About that string Akien asked about, I have to check the php source... 17:50:16 <filip_k> all pages left for conversion: 1(for-you, index.php, next, notes), calendar, thank-you, charter, 2010-sept-announcement.html, constitution, founders.html, media, reports (2010, 2011, 2012, index.php) 17:50:25 <obgr_seneca> I will do that and write a proposal by mail 17:50:48 <obgr_seneca> As Qilaq said, maybe reports first 17:51:19 <obgr_seneca> then media, constitution, thank-you 17:51:39 <Qilaq> and initial announcement is also important - though it's maybe already translated by some teams in html 17:51:58 <obgr_seneca> yes, maybe 17:52:01 <filip_k> I think the question is more should be expand strings for translation as much as possible arther then talk about those two strings 17:52:35 <obgr_seneca> hm? 17:52:36 <filip_k> there are many pages in html already 17:53:26 <filip_k> I suggest an idea for rda as I would need to setup a development server to code and test that 17:53:48 <filip_k> I hope he'll do that soon 17:54:27 <obgr_seneca> I suggested some "staging" server to test website changes before they go live some time ago 17:54:34 <filip_k> we need some info points in report ;) 17:54:44 <obgr_seneca> And I still consider it a good idea 17:54:51 <filip_k> me too 17:55:29 <filip_k> I missed navigation on one page for 10 minutes becuase of that ;) 17:55:56 <obgr_seneca> As long as rda is not here, should we go on with other topics? 17:56:21 <filip_k> please we should info those two decisions 17:56:27 <filip_k> about strings 17:56:38 <filip_k> and order of conversion 17:56:48 <obgr_seneca> oh sorry 17:57:13 <obgr_seneca> #info order of lang file coversion: report, media, constitution, thank-you 17:57:23 <obgr_seneca> #info then the rest as we go along 17:58:06 <obgr_seneca> ok? 17:58:26 <filip_k> yes. can I do with pages with less work before those? 17:58:43 <obgr_seneca> of course you can 17:58:49 <filip_k> great 17:58:51 <obgr_seneca> #action obgr_seneca look into that string change request done by Akien 18:00:14 <obgr_seneca> ok, next? 18:00:15 <filip_k> I still think the question is more should be expand strings for translation as much as possible rather then talk about those two strings as that will "broke" existing translations of those strings 18:00:39 <filip_k> but we should be as flexible as possible 18:00:50 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: good question 18:02:15 <filip_k> I think it's not too late to do that now. I need to look but I think that there is not much of such strings. 18:02:17 <obgr_seneca> should be considered with rda and others 18:02:43 <obgr_seneca> #undo 18:02:43 <Inigo_Montoya> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x84825ac> 18:02:45 <filip_k> I think that is our decision as it shouldn't affect rda 18:02:49 <MrsB> hello :) 18:03:10 <obgr_seneca> #idea check for strings that could be changed to give translators more flexibility 18:03:13 <obgr_seneca> right? 18:03:17 <filip_k> I can take a look and report about that on ML 18:03:19 <obgr_seneca> Hi MrsB :) 18:03:45 <MrsB> i was hoping somebody would attend from the en subteam 18:03:59 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: yes, but I would like to keep him informed 18:04:00 <MrsB> looks like it's me! 18:04:08 <filip_k> obgr_seneca: of course 18:04:11 <obgr_seneca> MrsB: you are welcome 18:04:40 <yurchor> obgr_seneca: It is always tradeoff: more flexibility=more formatting inside of strings, imho. 18:04:53 <obgr_seneca> yurchor: yes, I know 18:05:15 <filip_k> yurchor: exactly. so we need to go deeper for good decision 18:05:23 <obgr_seneca> but sometimes you need to reorder strings so they don't sound strange in your language 18:06:07 <filip_k> I'l take a look but I won't be so productive after this week as I go back to work ;) 18:06:15 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: :-( 18:06:32 <obgr_seneca> it would be so much better if we didn't have to work ;-) 18:06:38 <filip_k> ;) 18:07:11 <filip_k> but that php conversion is much easier for me than translating 18:07:23 <obgr_seneca> ok then 18:07:52 <obgr_seneca> but don't stop translating, would be a big whole in your team 18:08:00 <obgr_seneca> :D 18:08:19 <filip_k> I know. it's my priority #1 18:08:42 <obgr_seneca> ok, shall we go on? 18:08:48 <filip_k> please 18:09:08 <obgr_seneca> #topic leftover actions 18:09:50 <obgr_seneca> I know, I had pootle on my list, but I didn't get to it 18:10:07 <obgr_seneca> I will sit down with fwolff and the sysadmins about it 18:10:26 <obgr_seneca> yurchor: have you by any chance written that workflow thing about indifex tx? 18:11:09 <Qilaq> well, as a rule one should not break a sentence if there is no good reason 18:11:10 <yurchor> obgr_seneca: Is my message to ML not enough? 18:11:25 <obgr_seneca> yurchor: oups, I'' check 18:11:39 <Qilaq> sorry, it was about previous subject ... 18:12:20 <obgr_seneca> Qilaq: yes? 18:12:36 <filip_k> Qilaq: I'll try to post more info on ML about that and then we can decide better 18:13:40 <yurchor> obgr_seneca: https://www.mageia.org/pipermail/mageia-i18n/2012-July/003183.html 18:13:41 <obgr_seneca> Any other actions we missed? 18:13:56 <obgr_seneca> yurchor: thx, must have slipped my attention 18:14:49 <obgr_seneca> About wiki: I did ask for help on dev and discuss ml 18:14:56 <obgr_seneca> I hope somebody will react 18:15:10 <MrsB> I was going to try and help with that, sorry 18:15:27 <obgr_seneca> I have to finish my thesis for end of august and time has gotten a bit less then I thought 18:15:48 <obgr_seneca> #info MrsB will try and help with wiki 18:15:50 <obgr_seneca> thx 18:15:56 <Qilaq> I meant if there is a sentence/phrase like "Git, Subversion code repositories", it should not be broken in two- wasn't it the problem or have I understood something not right? 18:15:58 <MrsB> I'm away next week but if i get a chance I will have a look, not sure i will be much help though 18:16:52 <MrsB> is it uploads are the problem obgr_seneca? 18:17:15 <obgr_seneca> Qilaq: yes 18:17:29 <obgr_seneca> MrsB: uploads (and by extension of that math) 18:17:59 <MrsB> does that use a temp directory or something? 18:18:26 <obgr_seneca> MrsB: yes, it is in the readme urpmi of the package in testing 18:19:28 <filip_k> about pootle: fwolff just needs answers on those questions on ML and he said that he can put demo server in a few spare days 18:19:55 <obgr_seneca> yes, I will do, I promise! 18:20:35 <obgr_seneca> btw I did rewrite https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Internationalisation_Team_(i18n) a bit 18:20:47 <obgr_seneca> Any comments on it? 18:21:27 <MrsB> there isn't much in the way of basic docs for people new to i18n 18:22:12 <MrsB> I need to ask you about that but doing too many things at once at the moment :\ 18:22:30 <obgr_seneca> MrsB: you can always ask us in this channel 18:22:55 <obgr_seneca> (and if you want to be good, write our answers to some kind of i18n faq :D ) 18:22:59 <MrsB> yep 18:23:13 <MrsB> just need another hour in the day though please 18:23:35 <MrsB> where is a good place to start for the en menu's and things? 18:24:13 <MrsB> and if we download the pot and create a new po should we just email it to the list? 18:24:24 <obgr_seneca> MrsB: yes, please 18:24:35 <obgr_seneca> we will see to it, you get access to the svn 18:24:55 <obgr_seneca> About menu translations, the menu entries are created from the applications themselves 18:25:04 <MrsB> ok thanks, I'll try to organise an en team leader 18:25:07 <obgr_seneca> I'm not sure, what you are looking for exactly 18:25:46 <filip_k> in wiki: "Teams meetings of the Mageia internationalisation team are on Thursday evenings at 18:30 UTC ..." ;) 18:25:48 <MrsB> me either to tell the truth. There are some pot's somewhere for MCC and things like that we could translate to en_GB etc though presumably 18:26:56 <yurchor> MrsB: Can it be drakx tools? 18:27:04 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: should be fixed 18:27:18 <obgr_seneca> MrsB: or control-center? 18:27:19 <MrsB> probably so yes yurchor. I need to find more time to look into this :\ 18:27:25 <MrsB> that too :) 18:27:38 <filip_k> can someone tell me if Drakx-help.pot is not really needed anymore? 18:28:21 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: Damn it, I knew I wanted to ask 18:28:29 <MrsB> sorry, brb 18:28:48 <obgr_seneca> #action obgr_seneca ask devs about Drakx-help.pot, is it needed? 18:28:59 <filip_k> wiki now: "...are on every second Thursday ... 18:29:07 <obgr_seneca> #action filip_k ping obgr_seneca in two days about that 18:29:13 <obgr_seneca> ok? 18:29:17 <filip_k> great 18:29:46 <obgr_seneca> ok, other things? 18:30:02 <filip_k> good news: not from me ;) 18:30:11 <Qilaq> in Mandriva there was menu-messages-contrib/main/nonfree which made easy to have translated menu entries for programs not translated in your language upstream 18:30:38 <obgr_seneca> Qilaq: Yes I remember 18:30:49 <obgr_seneca> we should look into that 18:31:21 <obgr_seneca> #action ask devs about menu-messages pot for translating menu entries not translated upstream 18:31:59 <filip_k> it would be rally nice if there would be a list of things to translate in wiki 18:32:22 <Qilaq> though they had also strings from programs translated upstream 18:32:34 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Translation_resources_in_svn 18:32:36 <obgr_seneca> ? 18:32:44 <yurchor> filip_k: There is no doc/ManualB in my system or on the site, so I guess they are not used. 18:32:59 <obgr_seneca> Qilaq: I'm not sure how it was done, I'll have to check with some devs 18:33:15 <Qilaq> imho menu-messages-* were just collection of strings extracted from packages headers or something 18:33:34 <obgr_seneca> must be something along those lines 18:33:55 <filip_k> obgr_seneca: "Please note! This list is most certainly incomplete. ... Ask on the i18n ml if you are unsure." 18:34:01 <filip_k> I'm unsure ;)ć 18:34:11 <Qilaq> there are fields Name and Description what were extracted imho 18:34:22 * obgr_seneca too, that's why I put that line there 18:34:54 <obgr_seneca> Qilaq: probably, but I don't know for sure 18:35:14 <filip_k> yurchor: what about liveCD and DVD? 18:35:38 <yurchor> Nothing either. 18:35:51 <obgr_seneca> That's why I wanted to check with the devs 18:36:03 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: where can that pot file be found? 18:36:15 <yurchor> There are no special packages for Live only, imho. 18:36:50 <yurchor> obgr_seneca: http://svnweb.mageia.org/soft/drakx/trunk/perl-install/install/help/po/ 18:37:18 <filip_k> obgr_seneca: http://svn.mageia.org/svn/soft/drakx/trunk/perl-install/install/help/po/ 18:37:19 <obgr_seneca> #link http://svnweb.mageia.org/soft/drakx/trunk/perl-install/install/help/po/ 18:37:31 <obgr_seneca> thx, I didn#t find it 18:37:38 <Qilaq> which was not used already in Mandriva and most probably also in Mageia 18:38:08 <obgr_seneca> Qilaq: probably not, but then we could remove it from svn so we know for sure 18:38:59 <obgr_seneca> Ok, can we close for now, I should leave 18:39:01 <obgr_seneca> sorry 18:39:05 <filip_k> developers should decide if help will be online only 18:40:24 <filip_k> obgr_seneca: I can add resources for mga2 to wiki. Should I do that? 18:40:29 <obgr_seneca> yep, we will ask them 18:40:35 <obgr_seneca> filip_k: yes please 18:41:09 <filip_k> it's on my todo but I'll just mirror svn 18:41:27 <obgr_seneca> ok, thx 18:41:43 <filip_k> and info for that drax-hlp 18:42:05 <obgr_seneca> #info see if drakx-help is still needed 18:42:22 <obgr_seneca> #action filip_k add mga2 resources to wiki 18:42:30 <filip_k> without mga 1 ;) 18:43:18 <obgr_seneca> mga1 is end of life in a few months, I think we don't need much more translations there 18:43:29 <MrsB> Yay \o/ 18:43:29 <obgr_seneca> #chair filip_k 18:43:29 <Inigo_Montoya> Current chairs: filip_k obgr_seneca 18:43:43 <filip_k> can we please close 18:43:43 <obgr_seneca> could you end the meeting then? I have to go 18:43:48 <obgr_seneca> #endmeeting