19:13:00 <ennael> #startmeeting 19:13:00 <Inigo_Montoya> Meeting started Wed Mar 28 19:13:00 2012 UTC. The chair is ennael. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:13:00 <Inigo_Montoya> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 19:13:01 <erzulie> [ MeetBot - Debian Wiki ] 19:13:57 <ennael> ok as stated in mail our coming meetings will be focused on Mageia 2 19:14:22 <ennael> so mainly always the same topics, you should be fed up with it quite quickly :) 19:14:34 <ennael> #topic release_blocker bugs management 19:15:09 <ennael> ok we spoke about this during last council meeting 19:15:21 <ennael> given the current list of release_blocker bugs 19:15:45 <ennael> we may have to delay the release if it does not decrease fast enough 19:16:13 <ennael> see following url 19:16:14 <ennael> https://bugs.mageia.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=runnamed&namedcmd=release_blocker 19:16:15 <erzulie> [ Log in to Bugzilla ] 19:16:21 <ennael> erf 19:16:51 <doktor5000> ennael: https://bugs.mageia.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=dorem&remaction=run&namedcmd=release_blocker&sharer_id=69 19:16:52 <erzulie> [ Log in to Bugzilla ] 19:16:59 <ennael> https://bugs.mageia.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=dorem&remaction=run&namedcmd=release_blocker&sharer_id=69 19:17:00 <erzulie> [ Log in to Bugzilla ] 19:17:02 <ennael> oups 19:17:05 <ennael> ok that one 19:17:16 <remmy> We have gone down a few since the beginning of this week, and others are showing progress, but yeah, still a lot of them left. 19:17:25 <ennael> we need to work on that list 19:17:35 <ennael> some of them are really not release_blocker 19:17:47 <ennael> and may be dicreased 19:19:10 <remmy> ::nods:: 19:19:12 <ennael> "release_blocker" can be quite subjective no we need to agree on what should be release_blocker 19:20:07 <guillomovitch> apparently 20% of them are gnome bugs 19:20:12 <guillomovitch> and 40 % are installer bugs 19:20:30 <ennael> others are systemd :) 19:20:31 <ennael> oups 19:20:54 <remmy> guillomovitch: I guess we have to assists these guys where we can 19:21:12 <remmy> It is a bit much for single persons to work on 19:23:21 <ennael> well we may ask people to have a look 19:23:40 <ennael> check if reporters have made proper bug reports, ask again information 19:23:55 <remmy> Yup. But we can only ask the same thing so many times. 19:24:05 <ennael> and dicrease tag if no answer for a long time 19:24:22 <ennael> remmy: meaning ? 19:24:23 <remmy> I'll go through it with a fine haired comb on the weekend (but don't let that stop anyone from doing that before then :P ) 19:24:34 <Stormi> remmy: what about the "one day one blocker" mail to the mailing list idea from council meeting? 19:24:57 <remmy> ennael: We have asked quite a few times for help with this... I fear this is all the help we're going to get. 19:24:59 <Stormi> it can be a "different" way to ask "please help fixing blockers" 19:25:00 <ennael> can you please remind us what it was about ? 19:25:05 <remmy> But perhaps that's my pessimist nature. 19:25:37 <Stormi> it would be a daily e-mail sent to mageia-dev ML picking one bug report, explaining it, asking for someone to take it 19:25:53 <AL13N> Stormi: if you have an idea that might work, we should try it... we never know it might work 19:25:54 <Stormi> It might help focusing 19:26:10 <Stormi> the main problem is I will not be available to do it :) 19:26:55 <AL13N> perhaps someone from qa is wellsuited for this task 19:26:58 <ennael> well we can find people to do it 19:27:01 <ennael> not only qa team 19:27:11 <AL13N> well, it's best to be one person 19:27:18 <AL13N> or there are suddenly 5 emails a day 19:27:21 <AL13N> or none 19:27:37 <AL13N> or at least one person who can delegate to someone else 19:27:50 <ennael> I don't understand you at all :) 19:27:58 <remmy> Also, just an idea... do people know how they can test bug fixes on for example the installer ? I for example wouldn't know what to do without waiting for someone to build an iso for me. 19:28:29 <AL13N> remmy: there's a bug where tv explains to me how to do it, it's a bunch of work though 19:28:40 <ennael> I can build isos before RC 19:28:51 <Luigi12_work> network installation is an easy way to test the installer 19:29:12 <AL13N> well, yes, but the sqfs files should be rebuilt too 19:29:14 <remmy> AL13N: Maybe we should wikify that in some way... I'd feel bad to ask someone else to spend hours on building me something which might be broken anyways 19:29:25 <AL13N> remmy: i'll try and refind it and put it in the wiki 19:29:51 <ennael> I will ask also tv to give some tips and detail all this a bit more 19:31:04 <remmy> Thanks :) 19:31:29 <ennael> so what should be a release_blocker bug ? 19:31:42 <guillomovitch> a bug affecting me 19:31:46 <remmy> haha 19:31:47 <AL13N> :) 19:31:56 * Luigi12_work agrees with guillomovitch 19:32:01 <AL13N> well, we should agree in some form 19:32:03 <remmy> and > 10% of random users 19:32:10 <Luigi12_work> also something that could lock someone out of a server if they upgraded 19:32:13 <ennael> not precise enough 19:32:16 <Stormi> upgrade bugs are likely to be blockers 19:32:17 <Luigi12_work> or cause an upgrade to fail 19:32:22 <AL13N> but a voting will take too much time, and i don't think we can have any exact measures 19:32:27 <ennael> please 19:32:30 <ennael> one at a time 19:32:45 <remmy> Perhaps hardware support things should be set to major instead of blocking 19:33:04 <Luigi12_work> unless it's in the installer, since that can't be fixed later 19:33:13 <AL13N> i don't see any way to have a precise judgement, i think maybe this is for a team leader to decide 19:33:14 <Stormi> remmy: it depends on the range of affected hardware, to me 19:33:15 <ennael> yep that's a good part 19:33:24 <remmy> As well as esthetics, but I don't want them forgotten about either. 19:33:30 <ennael> installer and boot 19:33:32 <guillomovitch> what having some generel categories, perhaps as additional tracker bugs ? 19:33:48 <remmy> Some bugs, from scanning the list, should probably go to a tracker. 19:33:54 <Stormi> what a blocker is also depends on where we want to put the bar for quality 19:34:04 <Luigi12_work> someone said on the -dev list there are some things that need to be working on Live ISOs, as they can't be fixed later either. Maybe that point could be expanded upon. 19:34:15 <Stormi> it would also set a maximum number of major bugs 19:34:22 <ennael> well hidding bugs in tracker may not help that much 19:34:29 <guillomovitch> that's not hiding 19:34:29 <ennael> :) 19:34:32 <guillomovitch> rather sorting 19:34:33 <AL13N> so, "things that can't be fixed later, have reproducable data loss or hardware destruction, and which will show bad marketing value" ? 19:34:34 <doktor5000> Luigi12_work: usually no iso can be fixed later on 19:35:01 <ennael> sorting ok but it seems trackers have at the moment release_blocker and non blocker bugs 19:35:21 <remmy> Luigi12_work: In theory we could release an updated ISO, but we are short on manpower and QA for that. 19:35:46 <doktor5000> remmy: so that's a no in reality 19:35:53 <guillomovitch> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4880 19:35:55 <erzulie> [ Bug 4880 - Cannot get web pages with Java to work ] 19:35:57 <remmy> doktor5000: aye 19:36:01 <guillomovitch> clearly, this is not blocker, for instance 19:36:16 <remmy> guillomovitch: I think that one should be major, perhaps even critical, but not release blocking 19:36:19 <guillomovitch> and it is an isolated problem 19:36:32 <guillomovitch> not a general class of problems, as for systemd ones 19:36:52 <guillomovitch> ok, this is not a scientific rule 19:36:56 <AL13N> ok, i propose someone goes through them all, and lists the ones to be degraded in an email to -dev ML, and unless someone disagrees, to be decreased after 2 days 19:37:15 <Stormi> what about deciding a number of high priority bugs (but not blockers) above which we would not release ? 19:37:29 <remmy> AL13N: Sounds good to me... and I think we need ownership... all bugs but the tracker ones should not be assigned to bugsquad 19:37:33 <doktor5000> AL13N: agreed 19:37:41 <AL13N> so, who will do it? 19:37:44 <AL13N> any volunteers? 19:38:06 <remmy> AL13N: I can spend some time on saturday on it, but would prefer not to do it alone 19:38:19 <remmy> Stormi: +1 19:38:42 <ennael> I can have a look tomorrow afternoon 19:38:49 <Stormi> blockers are important since they are blockers, but other major bugs are important too, especially if numerous 19:38:56 <ennael> at leaset make a proposal 19:39:04 <AL13N> ok so ennael and remmy do it, and one takes upper numbers, other person lower numbers 19:39:18 <AL13N> agreed? 19:39:34 <remmy> AL13N: And anyone else who has a moment and cares :) 19:39:49 <AL13N> well, yes, but important is that all of them are done and none are missed 19:40:02 <AL13N> ennael: can you do #action , 19:40:03 <AL13N> ? 19:40:34 <guillomovitch> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5034 19:40:36 <erzulie> [ Bug 5034 - [TRACKER] Oxygen integration issues ] 19:40:38 <ennael> #action review of release_blocker and make proposals for keeping them all or not (ennael and stormi) 19:40:42 <guillomovitch> this one seems to be complete now 19:40:51 <ennael> yep some of them are done 19:41:02 <Stormi> stormi ? 19:41:07 <AL13N> lol 19:41:09 <Luigi12_work> guillomovitch: have you tried running oxygen theme in 16bpp? 19:41:11 <ennael> oups 19:41:12 <ennael> #undo 19:41:12 <Inigo_Montoya> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x83d9e4c> 19:41:21 <ennael> #action review of release_blocker and make proposals for keeping them all or not (ennael and remmy ) 19:41:23 <guillomovitch> Luigi12_work: I have no clue what oxygen theme is... 19:41:35 <Luigi12_work> guillomovitch: default gtk and gt widget theme 19:41:35 <ennael> guillomovitch: default one replacing ia_ora 19:41:47 <guillomovitch> I'm just trying to figure what's the full blocker dependency tree look like 19:41:56 <guillomovitch> a some problems are actually counted 3 times 19:42:08 <remmy> I'm still surprised that a theme can cause programs to crash... I remember when a theme was just some colours and a handful of icons. 19:42:29 <Luigi12_work> themes can have c/c++ code, always room for crashes 19:42:32 <ennael> it's also about drawing windows 19:42:36 <AL13N> about Stormi's idea... is that a good idea or not? 19:42:42 <guillomovitch> 4301, 4801 and 4802, for instance 19:43:02 <guillomovitch> if number is the single criteria, one kernel hacker may have an high-score there 19:43:35 <ennael> 4802 seems not release_blocker 19:43:42 <ennael> it can be fixed through updates 19:43:48 <guillomovitch> also 19:43:58 <guillomovitch> seems to be a good decision criteria 19:44:09 <guillomovitch> reducing the list to installer bugs mostly 19:44:27 <ennael> well there are some nasty bugs with systemd for example 19:44:27 <AL13N> ok, good 19:44:31 <ennael> that can prevent boot 19:44:45 <ennael> or make graphical environment unusable 19:44:48 <remmy> Ok, so let's reassess the next few days. And ensure that bugs get ownership, and that we also ask the owners what their timelines are and what help they need in order to close these bugs? 19:44:55 <ennael> yep 19:45:05 <ennael> so criteria for releas_blocker 19:45:08 <ennael> installer 19:45:12 <ennael> boot time 19:45:37 <guillomovitch> upgrade ? 19:45:41 <Luigi12_work> upgrade issues 19:45:42 <AL13N> hardware destruction 19:45:56 <remmy> house on fire 19:46:00 <guillomovitch> fridge emptying anf GF loss 19:46:01 <Luigi12_work> data destruction too, although I don't think we have any of those 19:46:03 <remmy> lol 19:46:10 <AL13N> and data destruction too 19:46:13 <ennael> upgrade 19:46:14 <Luigi12_work> "things that can't be fixed later" 19:46:15 <Stormi> system crash if not related to a specific piece of hardware? 19:46:26 <AL13N> (and don't laugh, at one time there was a firmware that destroyed the CDdrive) 19:46:31 <Stormi> and frequent 19:46:35 <Stormi> (not just one reporter) 19:46:41 <remmy> and: random crash < reproducable 19:46:47 <Luigi12_work> what about security issues? 19:46:56 <guillomovitch> they can be fixed later 19:47:00 <Luigi12_work> ok 19:47:00 <guillomovitch> it's just more work 19:47:06 <guillomovitch> as everything else done later 19:47:34 <ennael> security issues tracker is just a reminder 19:47:36 <guillomovitch> default are clearly not release blockers in this regards 19:47:36 <remmy> Other than 3921, most security ones are being picked up quite quickly I think 19:47:54 <ennael> yep 19:47:59 <doktor5000> maybe keep an eye out for the recent rpm db corruption issues as the problem was only workarounded, IIRC? 19:48:13 <ennael> I will ping also tv on this 19:48:37 <guillomovitch> bug 3921 is funny 19:48:48 <AL13N> ok, so, we need not go through this list right now 19:48:55 <AL13N> let's continue meeting 19:49:16 <ennael> #info criteria for release_blocker bugs: installer, boot time, upgrade, system crash, issues that can hardly be fixed through updates 19:49:36 <AL13N> Stormi had idea: "what about deciding a number of high priority bugs (but not blockers) above which we would not release ?" 19:49:41 <AL13N> is that somethign we want or not? 19:49:55 <Luigi12_work> if it can be fixed later, it can go in the errata? 19:50:02 <ennael> Luigi12_work: yep 19:50:38 <remmy> But would be good to flag any unsolved issues in the release notes / errata so people don't stumble into them when they want to install 19:50:57 <remmy> on their mothers sole computer who lives 300 km away from them 19:52:02 <ennael> ok anything else to add on that topic ? 19:52:13 <guillomovitch> which is a bad idea, even if your mother is living next door anyway :) 19:53:20 <AL13N> ennael: Stormi's idea? 19:53:26 <AL13N> Stormi had idea: "what about deciding a number of high priority bugs (but not blockers) above which we would not release ?" 19:53:42 <ennael> AL13N: well if we can have information about this before thus we why not 19:53:52 <ennael> this 19:54:06 <ennael> but it's a bit late so we would have to hurry 19:54:28 <Stormi> I looked at bugzilla : the high priority is rarely used 19:54:37 <Stormi> so it would require to define what is "high" 19:54:46 <guillomovitch> not blocking :) 19:54:46 <AL13N> we have to hurry for fixing all the bugs too, so maybe not at this time 19:54:50 <Stormi> and then look at all bugs :) 19:55:03 <ennael> okok 19:55:07 <AL13N> ok, then let's not atm, and proceed to next topic 19:55:09 <guillomovitch> format definition "evertyhing that was previously consisted blocked, but later degraded as we don't have enough time" 19:55:21 <AL13N> :) 19:55:45 * Luigi12_work marks all his bugs blocking so they can be high priority :o) 19:55:58 <ennael> ok I guess next topic is already done (security updates) 19:56:04 <remmy> Luigi12_work: That's fine, if you also resolve them in the next week :) 19:56:12 <ennael> as it seems they are nearly all done 19:56:30 <Luigi12_work> well the java one has been sitting for quite some time 19:56:43 <Luigi12_work> I think dmorgan has been busy with work 19:56:54 <Luigi12_work> the others I'm not too worried about 19:57:22 <Luigi12_work> I would like some feedback on the expat one actually 19:57:28 <ennael> ok 19:57:32 <guillomovitch> I'll take care of it 19:57:35 <ennael> did you mail -dev about it ? 19:57:36 <guillomovitch> meaning: building 19:57:43 <Luigi12_work> ennael: no not yet 19:58:02 <Luigi12_work> expat is totally unmaintained, so eventually we need to resync it with Mandriva (fixes for library policy) 19:58:04 <guillomovitch> I just reassgined it to myself 19:58:12 <Luigi12_work> in the short term, we can probably just patch it 19:58:18 <Luigi12_work> guillomovitch: thanks 19:58:37 <Luigi12_work> also I hope someone can help with the libzip test error, I'll look closer at it at some point, but no guarantee I'll figure it out 20:01:02 <remmy> guillomovitch: Thanks for submitting it :) 20:01:11 <guillomovitch> you're welcome 20:01:33 <ennael> can we switch to next topic ? 20:01:37 <remmy> yup 20:01:38 <Luigi12_work> yep 20:01:42 <AL13N> k 20:02:03 <ennael> #topic broken dependancies 20:02:17 <ennael> so this is a reminder and also a way to kick ass ! :) 20:03:11 <Luigi12_work> ennael: you're referring to the check.mageia.org reports I assume 20:03:14 <ennael> http://check.mageia.org/cauldron/dependencies.html 20:03:14 <erzulie> [ dependencies global report ] 20:03:35 <guillomovitch> I think the kmod ones 20:03:46 <guillomovitch> are juste side-effect of kernel upgrade 20:03:56 <AL13N> 5 have no maintainer 20:03:57 <guillomovitch> old packages not removed the mirror 20:04:14 <ennael> ok so it means all this can be solved in 2 or 3 days :) 20:04:14 <Luigi12_work> I think I remember MDV dropping gnome-python-gtkmozembed recently 20:04:19 <guillomovitch> I can manage the perl ones 20:04:22 <guillomovitch> at leas try 20:04:48 <remmy> What is the impact if these things are not solved? 20:04:54 <guillomovitch> they are not installable 20:04:57 <guillomovitch> without --nodeps 20:04:59 <remmy> (Just for my noob understanding) 20:05:03 <guillomovitch> usually 20:05:10 <remmy> So, one can't install iceape for example? 20:05:12 <guillomovitch> ocsinventory ... 20:05:25 <Luigi12_work> I think some come from packaging changes where a package is renamed or dropped and not obsoleted somewhere 20:05:32 <guillomovitch> yes 20:05:46 <remmy> Gotcha, thanks. 20:06:11 <guillomovitch> unfortunatly, release number doesn't appear 20:06:28 <guillomovitch> so many times, it's a remnant after an update 20:06:46 <guillomovitch> http://check.mageia.org/cauldron/missing.html 20:06:47 <erzulie> [ missing global report ] 20:07:06 <guillomovitch> this one more specifically tracks binary without matching source packages 20:07:14 <doktor5000> remmy: iceape is another issue for itself, feel free to comment on -dev thread about this (applies to every packager) 20:07:29 * doktor5000 fixed iceape issue just now (locally) 20:07:30 <guillomovitch> ennael: only admins, AFAIK, can cleanup the mirrors 20:07:32 <Luigi12_work> I was told a script is supposed to delete old libraries (changed major) after 2 weeks, but I see some here older than that 20:07:38 <remmy> doktor5000: Aye, I saw that... 20:07:41 <ennael> guillomovitch: ok so this is for sysadmin 20:07:43 <ennael> boklm: around ? 20:07:45 <guillomovitch> making the other report more accurate 20:07:50 <Luigi12_work> I know it was more than two weeks ago I upgraded netpbm for instane 20:07:52 <doktor5000> remmy: comment then, please! 20:08:04 <remmy> doktor5000: I should put your mails on my to do list :) 20:08:33 <guillomovitch> I'd have to see with pterjan how we could avoid reporting issues twice in this regard 20:08:42 <AL13N> shouldn't they just be rebuilt with proper obsoletes? 20:08:52 <AL13N> or am i mistaking with something else? 20:09:07 <guillomovitch> obsolete should not be used 20:09:15 <guillomovitch> as a way to cleanup mirrors 20:09:16 <ennael> #action ask sysadmin about repository cleaning 20:09:23 <Luigi12_work> not for libraries, some of the other things on there could be fixed with obsoletes 20:09:33 <AL13N> guillomovitch: so the cause of these wasn't forgotten obsoletes then? 20:09:34 <guillomovitch> that's not obsolete tag purpose 20:09:38 <guillomovitch> no 20:09:45 <AL13N> ok nvm 20:10:23 <guillomovitch> you should not abuse package metadata just to handle this kind of transient issues 20:10:48 <guillomovitch> ennael: I'd said, once sysadmin did their jobs at cleaning 20:10:59 <AL13N> ok 20:11:18 <AL13N> is it a problem that 5 of them do not have maintainer? 20:11:22 <guillomovitch> I'm volonteer to remind packagers about those issues 20:11:29 <guillomovitch> it is 20:11:40 <AL13N> well, not if they are the transient kind :-) 20:12:00 <guillomovitch> I'll take care of the task-nagios one 20:12:20 <ennael> boklm: can sysadmin have a look on cleaning ? 20:12:37 <boklm> yes 20:13:12 <boklm> remove binary packages without source package ? 20:13:26 <ennael> yep 20:13:28 <guillomovitch> and the opposite also :) 20:13:33 <ennael> also :) 20:13:40 <boklm> ok 20:14:02 <boklm> pterjan started a script for this, we need to finish it 20:14:20 <ennael> ok 20:14:59 * boklm will look tomorrow 20:16:55 <ennael> next topic ? 20:17:09 <remmy> aye 20:17:27 <ennael> #topic QA tests on upgrade 20:17:27 <Luigi12_work> wait 20:17:33 <ennael> #undo 20:17:33 <Inigo_Montoya> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Topic object at 0x8442b2c> 20:17:39 <ennael> shoot 20:17:43 <Luigi12_work> sorry one last thing for sysadmins 20:17:59 <Luigi12_work> a report that says what packages are older in Cauldron than Mageia 1 (including updates) 20:18:36 <Luigi12_work> that is all, and it actually ties in with the next topic 20:18:43 <Luigi12_work> I already caught one this week by testing upgrades 20:18:48 <AL13N> oh 20:19:09 <Luigi12_work> but if the sysadmins could generate a report, that would be better 20:19:23 <Luigi12_work> we can only catch the packages we actually have installed in upgrade tests 20:19:31 <ennael> boklm: can you have a look on this ? 20:19:38 * boklm will look 20:19:46 <ennael> thanks 20:20:35 <ennael> #action sysadmin will work on getting a list of packages older in cauldron than in Mageia 1 updates 20:21:42 <ennael> next topic ? 20:21:44 <Stormi> yes 20:22:17 <ennael> #topic QA tests on upgrade 20:22:21 <ennael> QA ? 20:22:31 <Stormi> QA started tests one week ago 20:22:42 <Stormi> current results are rather good 20:22:43 <Luigi12_work> I've been testing upgrades since Friday 20:22:50 <Luigi12_work> yes, not many issues 20:23:05 <Stormi> however it would be good to be backed by testers from outside QA 20:24:15 <Stormi> so those who have a mageia 1 computer and want to upgrade at some point, maybe now is the good moment 20:24:18 <AL13N> i'll try and do an upgrade test 20:24:34 <ennael> Stormi: could you please send a mail on -dev 20:24:35 <AL13N> i'll clone a vm and upgrade 20:24:38 <ennael> reviewing these tests ? 20:24:43 <AL13N> what is the best way to upgrade? 20:24:53 <Stormi> ennael: actually I send a mail to QA team asking for a volunteer to do it :) 20:24:56 <ennael> AL13N: there is no best way :) 20:24:57 <Stormi> sent* 20:24:58 <remmy> And some instructions on how to upgrade and how to move your install to a vm or something 20:25:00 <ennael> arf :) 20:25:05 <AL13N> ennael: errr 20:25:09 <Luigi12_work> network or hard drive installer if you have a local mirror is the easiest 20:25:17 <Stormi> as my time is limited and i will be away from computer for 10 days soon 20:25:17 <remmy> I still need my 1 box for updates to 1 :) 20:25:21 <ennael> upgrade has to be test through isos, cli and mgaonline 20:25:34 <AL13N> ic 20:25:45 <Stormi> I'll send a mail again to QA and make sure there's a mail that comes to -dev whatever the way 20:25:56 <Stormi> with relevant information 20:25:57 <AL13N> as a reference a while back i upgraded my dads mdv to mga one, and mgaonline failed to do it 20:25:59 <Luigi12_work> yeah I should probably do a urpmi test 20:25:59 <ennael> ok thanks for that 20:26:02 <AL13N> i used urpmi sources 20:26:15 <ennael> AL13N: api needed to be fixed 20:26:26 <ennael> it has been done today by rda 20:26:32 <AL13N> ah 20:28:33 <ennael> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5135 20:28:35 <erzulie> [ Bug 5135 - https://releases.mageia.org/api/a/testing-i586 should be updated for testing mgaaplet prior to mga2 release ] 20:29:20 <ennael> anything else to add ? 20:30:14 <AL13N> i have something small, but not really this topic 20:30:40 <remmy> I have something small on a non agenda topic too 20:31:05 <AL13N> hmm 20:31:41 <ennael> ok let's go now 20:31:54 <AL13N> remmy: you go first 20:32:02 <remmy> haha, I was about to type the same 20:32:02 <remmy> ok 20:32:05 <AL13N> lol 20:32:18 <remmy> Just about being a maintainer for a given package 20:32:43 <remmy> I am just a padawan still, but more than once in the past month or so, a package for which I (stormi) has been listed as maintainer 20:32:49 <remmy> has been submitted by others 20:33:01 <remmy> One time this had to be reversed 20:33:20 <remmy> the other time it were small changes which I don't know where they came from 20:33:26 <remmy> there was no bug report or anything 20:33:33 <remmy> What is the best way of dealing with this? 20:33:58 <Luigi12_work> I'm not sure we have enough maintainers to have a hard rule about this 20:34:05 <remmy> I don't want to come across as being easily offended, but I do wonder what the value is of being listed as maintainer when people upload changes without checking or consulting 20:34:20 <doktor5000> remmy: ping the commiter/submitter via mail and ask for reasons? 20:34:22 <Luigi12_work> if there's a particular package someone touches and you don't like it, just ask the person (directly if possible) to go through you for that package in the future 20:34:40 <AL13N> well, i'm not certain, but i think there are some people who don't check and consult or anything and just for example do a new version 20:35:02 * doktor5000 thinks about funda :) 20:35:11 <Luigi12_work> well I've done that too 20:35:34 <Luigi12_work> mainly tried to do it with ones that don't appear to be actively maintained 20:35:40 <AL13N> O_o 20:35:45 <AL13N> Luigi12_work: tssk 20:36:05 <AL13N> Luigi12_work: i try to send patch via email or make bug report and assign 20:36:10 <remmy> I don't want Mageia to become bureaucratic... but I only found out by checking the rsync message from my mirror as well as stormi seeing a message on -dev by chance. 20:36:21 <doktor5000> i don't mind anyone updating my stuff if i don't get to it in time (as for wireshark freeze push by guillomovitch) if it doesn't do more harm than it does good 20:36:29 <Luigi12_work> it's good to watch the changelog list like a hawk :o) 20:36:40 <remmy> I don't mind a rebuild because of library x being fixed or something 20:36:56 <remmy> but changes to the package itself, I'd like to be notified of in advance 20:37:03 <AL13N> yes, me too 20:37:04 <remmy> (and then I'll prolly say: go ahead) 20:37:11 <AL13N> but afaik the best way is to follow the changelog 20:37:13 <Luigi12_work> yeah I try not to make major changes without asking 20:37:17 <AL13N> and filter it with your packages 20:37:26 <Stormi> I plan, via madb, to offer packagers the way to subscribe to submits of their packages (if a sysadmin doesn't do that kind of stuff before based on svn :)) 20:37:36 <Luigi12_work> Stormi: neat 20:37:47 <AL13N> Luigi12_work: well, even if it's a little change, explain it in commit mesage or in comment in spec file why or what you do 20:37:53 <remmy> Stormi: That's enough incentive for me to look into working on madb too :) 20:37:54 <AL13N> Stormi: neat 20:38:05 <Luigi12_work> AL13N: yes I like to think I do good commit messages 20:38:10 <AL13N> k 20:38:13 <Stormi> (it's already possible to subscribe to packages, one by one, in one of the demo instances, but I must create users one by one) 20:38:13 <AL13N> ennael: ping 20:38:16 <ennael> yep 20:38:17 <Luigi12_work> don't be afraid to call me out on IRC if I don't :o) 20:38:22 <remmy> Ok, thanks for the input guys... I'll learn to live with it for now :P 20:38:30 <AL13N> ennael: about my small topic 20:38:44 <ennael> I suggest we go back on maintainance pb after release 20:38:52 <AL13N> ennael: iinm you are the only candidate for packaging team leader? 20:38:54 <Luigi12_work> maintainance pb? 20:39:07 <Luigi12_work> oh nvm 20:39:31 <AL13N> ennael: i would like some of the expert packagers to be on the team leaders, but people i've asked, didn't have the time 20:39:35 <ennael> AL13N: We will have a look on this later but still it seems guillomovitch agreed on applying 20:39:55 <AL13N> ennael: if it helps at all, i would be an extra volunteer for team leader 20:39:56 <ennael> *fear* 20:40:05 <AL13N> ennael: but i donno if i ahve the skillset for it 20:40:12 <AL13N> ennael: so you're welcome to deny me 20:40:35 <Luigi12_work> what is the packaging team leader for? 20:40:43 <AL13N> ennael: i'm just thinking that more people will mean less work/person 20:40:50 <guillomovitch> to say other people volonteered 20:40:56 <guillomovitch> when they only asked questions :) 20:40:59 <Luigi12_work> lol 20:41:11 <ennael> :) 20:41:24 <ennael> can we have a look on that topic in next meeting ? 20:41:25 <AL13N> ennael: lemme know how you feel about it 20:41:28 <AL13N> but sure 20:41:36 <ennael> will write a quick mail in between about this 20:41:44 * ennael is just falling asleep :) 20:41:50 <AL13N> it's ok, it's not 100% pressing matter 20:42:01 <ennael> ok 20:42:03 * AL13N is tired too 20:42:08 <ennael> #endmeeting